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From: The One
To: This world of moslem shit
Date: Fri Dec 28 04:08:56 2001

Message:
I have had enough of bin-pigfucker leacturing me about how 
things are here in America. If we truly hated islam, islam would 
be going up in mushroom clouds from Indonesia to Kosovo to 
Alegria...Fuck him, fuck Islam, Fuck Jihad, Fuck Reid, Fuck 
Walker, Fuck Al Qaeda, Fuck Omar Fuck The Taliban Fuck Saddam, 
Fuck Arafat and fuck every single womb that gave birth to this 
garbage, wait, scratch that one- would be counter or re-
productive and we don't need that!
The Tribunals need to start now, with these fuckers in custody 
or not, and they should be sentenced to death in absentia, the 
CIA can be given warrants to 
knock them off one by one. Then they will shut their mouths and 
those stupid eyes always staring at me. Reid should be killed 
for being ugly alone. These people must start dying soon. I hope 
one of them pulls some shit with the Marines and they just 
unload magazine after magazine into em.
This will never stop until arab fucking pigs start dying by 
American steel and powder. Everywhere I look in the moslem world 
there is death and fighting
or calls for war, peaceful religion my fucking ass...Islam 
better start getting it's shit together or it's going to find 
that these idiots have led it to become
a world-wide pariah. Then who will stop us? 

From: The One
To: and spare me
Subject: your lectures...
Date: Fri Dec 28 04:11:04 2001

Message:
Those of you buried in your own pathetic bleeding heart 
humanistic worlds can spare me your intellectual judgements.
It was a simple emmotional response and it defies both logic 
and gravity, so don't waste your precious spell checkers and 
tell me that terrorists can be controlled by diplomacy when we 
all should have the courage to admit to ourselves that they only 
understand blood and bullets. This is the level that frightens 
you lawyers, teachers, zookeepers and small cowering farm 
animals, but it's the level at which this game must be played in 
order to maintain civility. Call it a sacrifice.
You are never going to stop terrorism with words, it must be 
exploding steel and you know it, so admit it.

I was made in America and I am America...and if you don't like 
me you can go straight to hell and burn, but you bitches will 
stop trying to kill me.

From: Thisholebites
To:
Date: Sat Oct 6 15:06:46 2001

Message:
Tired of twisted assholes speaking in God's name, just ask 
Christ, and forget what men think. One day we will all be dust.
Bin, Omar and all the rest of Satan's boys need judgement from 
Christ.
Yea we are agressive now, Wait till you see what God does to
them!!
Deliver us from these hateful assholes Lord, in Jesus name.

From: thisholebites
To: The one
Subject: You tell em dude!!!
Date: Fri Dec 28 06:12:16 2001

Message:
Today the muslim world has chosen to call Jesus Christ a 
deceiver, when it was mohammed that lied about his cause for his 
own gains. They say Christ cast his image on a disciple and that 
a disciple died in his place and there was no ressurection. 
Sounds like Satan is pissed about losing for eternity and wants 
to call you to hell by denying Christ is your Saviour. Yep, in 
the name of God they have lied and killed all for their own 
glory, church lady, could it be   SSSSS....satan!!!
Last call before the big hall!!!
muslims repent of that crap belief now, America is the only 
country in history to not use the power it possesed to rule the 
world. oh yea, we could have, but didn't. can any muslim country 
say that, hell no, in fact the reason muslim clerics continue 
with the same tired message, "we have too much freedom" is 
because it is their greatest fear. they know that if their own 
poeple were given a choice about living in the west vs Iran, 
iraq, etc,... there would be no one left to hear their bullshit.
All would leave.
Another example of their fears are evident in how they treat 
their women, they want to hide from their sins by covering a 
womans face. They believe in this way they are not distracted, 
WRONG!!!! God sees your heart,and you are condemed for placing 
your sins on a woman to bear your shame, why don't you put it on 
your camels, you know you want them!!! And as far as following a 
bunch of clerics and ayatollahs because they have studied.
well it don't take a rocket scientist to see their hatred for 
all. they are men, dispicable sinners before God. Never trust 
men, any religion that does not say, ask the Lord wants 
something from you. Seek Christ!!! He approaches with sword in 
hand!

From: Walter
To: The One Idiot
Date: Fri Dec 28 08:05:01 2001

Message:
I have had enough of bin-pigfucker leacturing me about how 
                things are here in America. If we truly hated 
islam, islam would 
                   be going up in mushroom clouds from Indonesia 
to Kosovo to 
                  Alegria...Fuck him, fuck Islam, Fuck Jihad, 
Fuck Reid, Fuck 
                 Walker, Fuck Al Qaeda, Fuck Omar Fuck The 
Taliban Fuck Saddam, 
                 Fuck Arafat and fuck every single womb that gave 
birth to this 
                    garbage_________________________________
 And fuck George Bush,and fuck the piece of shit that calls 
itself your mother,and fuck you.

From: Walter
To: thisholebites
Date: Fri Dec 28 08:27:04 2001

Message:
Tired of twisted assholes speaking in God's name________________
 Yes,many of us are,give it a rest,get some help.

From: om/cf
To: The One & This Bites & All
Subject: Whew!
Date: Fri Dec 28 08:07:32 2001

Message:
Just when I thought I was too far right I suddenly feel like
Al Gore! Thanks. I dont know why diplomacy has to play into this
fight all......except that if we aimlessly attack all Muslim
countrys we are the pariah. Also there are millions of Muslims
in the U.S. to be exterminated and I just have a crazy feeling
that might destroy America in the process. No lecture, just 
throwing out thoughts. Im a wannabe Zookeeper.
===============================================================
Now I dont know crap about religion, but if Im in a church and I 
hear this one Im outta there!

Deliver us from these hateful assholes Lord, in Jesus name.

==============================================================
 There seems to be a pattern in Parents responses, when their
children get in trouble regaurding terrorism, and they are thrust
onto the world stage.
 All are wonderful children who must have been BRAINWASHED!
 


From: Justice
To: Ashraf
Subject: proof
Date: Fri Dec 28 09:24:01 2001

Message:
Ibrahim Helal, chief editor of Al-Jazeera TV, said the network 
decided to air the statement in full Thursday "because the 
content of the tape actually proves for the first time that bin 
Laden is really behind it, the attacks."

Hey Ashraf.  Do you still believe that bin Laden had nothing to 
do with the attacks?  I am not sure if you still believe that.  
I haven't seen many postings from you in a while.  If you still 
don't think he is involved, please explain.

From: Spy
To: om/cf
Date: Fri Dec 28 09:14:00 2001

Message:
I always envisioned brainwashing as ie. someone 
kidnapping my butt and then pulling a clock work orange on 
me.
Those like the sneaker man and the walker kid that seek out 
such ways; I have trouble with buying the "brainwashing" 
plea. 
Of course I doubt if walker's parents got any pta awards.

From: Merlyn
To: E.S.D.
Subject: Jesus
Date: Fri Dec 28 10:14:12 2001

Message:
Jesus was a man above all in many ways. The Bible and Koran are 
but books written by those who interpret their world at the 
time. No book is the "word of god" only a jaded interpretation 
by a man. Preaching from the Bible will get you preaching from 
the Koran. The reason the Druids never wrote anything down is to 
make dogma of their beliefs imposable. 
 Make no mistake; Jesus was of the earth religion, trying to 
teach in a world full of Roman dogma. Mentioning Jesus will 
never offend me, he is a cornerstone of human compassion. 
  Preaching from a Bible only alienates those who don't believe 
and gets you an ear full of their dogma. Moses tried to write 
Gods word and so did Mohamed, go figure. 
  Religion is a word for the unspoken inspiration, and cannot be 
expressed in our lame language. Only our experience can be 
related through language. And each of us will have a different 
personal experience. Imposing death as divine is a work of sick 
misguided men with personal agendas. 
  America has had its gut full of war since before it was an 
English colony. We know our world as a place full of religious 
hatred. That is why we are the targets of these Dogmatic 
religious extremists. We are trying to establish a method of 
government based on education that is void of imposed religious 
dogma. Yes this fly s in the face of history, with attitude! 
  In the next post, you will see why...
            Merlyn  

From: om/cf
To: Spy
Date: Fri Dec 28 09:58:25 2001

Message:
Exactly. I hear no mention of Taliban John being kidnapped and
taken to Pakistan. Hell his parents sent him money to keep his
ass over there, then to hear them whine about his fate just 
burns me up. Poor boy my ass! Its just a shame there arent any 
more good American cults like Jonestown for dumb asses like 
Johnny.
 Im just glad those disco shoes with the giant heels arent making
a comeback. Imagine all the customized C4 you could fit in those
goofy fucking things! And those shoes combined with brightly
colored cheap polyester suits would be a good look for Reid,
although he seems to prefer the orange jumpsuit. 
 

From: Merlyn
To: E.S.D.
Subject: Gut full of war
Date: Fri Dec 28 10:51:36 2001

Message:
Be it just cause to stop ethnic cleansing, military imposition 
or the Palistine problem of today, America has never known 
peace. It is a foreign word to America that needs redifined. 



The following list shows you all "peace actions" of the USA 
after WW2:
Korea-Krieg: 27. Juni 1950 bis 27. Juli 1953
Suez-Krise:  gypten, 26. Juli 1956 bis 15. November 1956
Operation "Blue Bat": Libanon, 15. Juli 1958 bis 20. Oktober 1958
Taiwan-Stra e: 23. August 1958 bis 1. Juni 1963
Kongo: 14. Juli 1960 bis 1. September 1962
Operation "Tailwind": Laos, 1970
Operation "Ivory Coast/Kingoin": Nordvietnam, 21. November 1970
Operation "Endweep": Nordvietnam, 27. Januar 1972 bis 27. Juli 
1973
Operation "Linebacker I": Nordvietnam, 10. Mai 1972 bis 23. 
Oktober 1972
Operation "Linebacker II": Nordvietnam, 18. Dezember 1972 bis 
29. Dezember 1972
Operation "Pocket Money": Nordvietnam, 9. Mai 1972 bis 23. 
Oktober 1972
Operation "Freedom Train": Nordvietnam, 6. April 1972 bis 10. 
Mai 1972
Operation "Arc Light": S dostasien, 18. Juni 1965 bis April 1970
Operation "Rolling Thunder": S dvietnam, 24. Februar 1965 bis 
Oktober 1968
Operation "Ranch Hand": S dvietnam, Januar 1962 bis Januar 1971
Kuba-Krise: weltweit, 24. Oktober 1962 bis 1. Juni 1963
Operation "Powerpack": Dominikanische Republik, 28. April 1965 
bis 21. September 1966
Sechs-Tage-Krieg: Mittlerer Osten, 13. Mai 1967 bis 10. Juni 1967
Operation "Nickel Grass": Mittlerer Osten, 6. Oktober 1973 bis 
17. November 1973
Operation "Eagle Pull": Kambodscha, 11. April 1975 bis 13. April 
1975
Operation "Freequent Wind": Evakuierung in S dvietnam, 26. April 
1975
bis 30. April 1975
Operation "Mayaguez": Kambodscha, 15. Mai 1975
Operationen "Eagle Claw/Desert One": Iran, 25. April 1980
El Salvador, Nikaragua: 1. Januar 1981 bis 1. Februar 1992
Operation "Golf von Sidra": Libyen, 18. August 1981
US-Multinational Force: Libanon, 25. August 1982 bis 11. 
Dezember 1987
Operation "Urgent Fury": Grenada, 23. Oktober 1982 bis 21. 
November 1983
Operation "Attain Document": Libyen, 26. Januar 1986 bis 29. 
M rz 1986
Operation "El Dorado Canyon": Libyen, 12. April 1986 bis 17. 
April 1986
Operation "Blast Furnace": Bolivien, Juli 1986 bis November 1986
Operation "Ernest Will": Persischer Golf, 24. Juli 1987 bis 2. 
August 1990
Operation "Praying Mantis": Persischer Golf, 17. April 1988 bis 
19. April 1988
Operation "Just Cause": Panama, 20. Dezember 1989 bis 31. Januar 
1990
Operation "Nimrod Dancer": Panama, Mai 1989 bis 20. Dezember 1989
Operation "Promote Liberty": Panama, 31. Januar 1990
Operation "Ghost Zone": Bolivien, M rz 1990 bis 1993
Operation "Sharp Edge": Liberia, Mai 1990 bis 8. Januar 1991
Operation "Desert Farewell": S dwest-Asien, 1. Januar 1992 bis 
1992
Operation "Desert Calm": "S dwest-Asien, 1. M rz 1991 bis 1. 
Januar 1992
Operation "Desert Shield": 2. August 1990 bis 17. Januar 1991
Operation "Desert Storm": Irak, 17. Januar 1991 bis 28. Februar 
1991
Operation "Eastern Exit": Somalia, 2. Januar 1991 bis 11. Januar 
1991
Operation "Productiv Effort/Sea Angel": Bangladesh, Mai 1991 bis 
Juni 1991
Operation "Fiery Vigil": Philippinen, 1. bis 30. Juni 1991
Operation "Victor Squared": Haiti, 1. bis 30. September 1991
Operation "Quick Lift": Zaire, 24. September 1991 bis 7. Oktober 
1991
Operation "Silver Anvil": Sierra Leone, 2. Mai 1992 bis 5. Mai 
1992
Operation "Distant Runner": Ruanda, 9. April 1994 bis 15. April 
1994
Operationen "Quiet Resolve"/"Support Hope": Ruanda, 22. Juli 
1994 bis 30. September 1994
Operation "Uphold/Restore Democracy": Haiti, 19. September 1994 
bis 31. M rz 1995
Operation "United Shield": Somalia, 22. Januar 1995 bis 25. M rz 
1995
Operation "Assured Response": Liberia, April 1996 bis August 1996
Operation "Quick Response": Zentralafrikanische Republik, Mai 
1996 bis August 1996
Operation "Guardian Assistance": Zaire/Ruanda/Uganda, 15. 
November 1996 bis 27. Dezember 1996
Operation "Pacific Haven/Quick Transit": Irak - Guam, 15. 
September 1996 bis 16. Dezember 1996
Operation "Guardian Retrieval": Kongo, M rz 1997 bis Juni 1997
Operation "Noble Obelisk": Sierra Leone, Mai 1997 bis Juni 1997
Operation "Bevel Edge": Kambodscha, Juli 1997
Operation "Noble Response": Kenia, 21. Januar 1998 bis 25. M rz 
1998
Operation "Shepherd Venture": Guinea-Bissau, 10. Juni 1998 bis 
17. Juni 1998
Operation "Infinite Reach": Sudan/Afghanistan, 20. bis 30. 
August 1998
Operation "Golden Pheasant": Honduras, ab M rz 1988
Operation "Safe Border": Peru/Ekuador, ab 1995
Operation "Laser Strike": S dafrika, ab 1. April 1996
Operation "Steady State": S damerika, 1994 bis April 1996
Operation "Support Justice": S damerika, 1991 bis 1994
Operation "Wipeout": Hawaii, ab 1990
Operation "Coronet Oak": Zentral- und S damerika, Oktober 1977 
bis 17. Februar 1999
Operation "Coronet Nighthawk": Zentral- und S damerika, ab 1991
Operation "Desert Falcon": Saudi Arabien, ab 31. M rz 1991
Operation "Northern Watch": Kurdistan, ab 31. Dezember 1996
Operation "Provide Comfort": Kurdistan, 5. April 1991 bis 
Dezember 1994
Operation "Provide Comfort II": Kurdistan, 24. Juli 1991 bis 31. 
Dezember 1996
Operation "Vigilant Sentine I": Kuwait, ab August 1995
Operation "Vigilant Warrior": Kuwait, Oktober 1994 bis November 
1994
Operation "Desert Focus": Saudi Arabien, ab Juli 1996
Operation "Phoenix Scorpion I": Irak, ab November 1997
Operation "Phoenix Scorpion II": Irak, ab Februar 1998
Operation "Phoenix Scorpion III": Irak, ab November 1998
Operation "Phoenix Scorpion IV": Irak, ab Dezember 1998
Operation "Desert Strike": Irak, 3. September 1996; Cruise 
Missile-Angriffe: Irak, 26. Juni 1993, 17. Januar 1993, 
Bombardements: Irak, 13. Januar 1993
Operation "Desert Fox": Irak, 16. Dezember 1998 bis 20. Dezember 
1998
Operation "Provide Promise": Bosnien, 3. Juli 1992 bis 31. M rz 
1996
Operation "Decisive Enhancement": Adria, 1. Dezember 1995 bis 
19. Juni 1996
Operation "Sharp Guard": Adria, 15. Juni 1993 bis Dezember 1995
Operation "Maritime Guard": Adria, 22. November 1992 bis 15. 
Juni 1993
Operation "Maritime Monitor": Adria, 16. Juli 1992 bis 22. 
November 1992
Operation "Sky Monitor": Bosnien-Herzegowina, ab 16. Oktober 1992
Operation "Deliberate Forke": Bosnien-Herzegowina, ab 20. Juni 
1998
Operation "Decisive Edeavor/Decisive Edge": Bosnien-Herzegowina, 
Januar 1996 bis Dezember 1996
Operation "Deny Flight": Bosnien, 12. April 1993 bis 20. 
Dezember 1995
Operation "Able Sentry": Serbien-Mazedonien, ab 5. Juli 1994
Operation "Nomad Edeavor": Taszar, Ungarn, ab M rz 1996
Operation "Nomad Vigil": Albanien, 1. Juli 1995 bis 5. November 
1996
Operation "Quick Lift": Kroatien, Juli 1995
Operation "Deliberate Force": Republika Srpska, 29. August 1995 
bis 21. September 1995
Operation "Joint Forge": ab 20. Juni 1998
Operation "Joint Guard": Bosnien-Herzegowina, 20. Juni 1998
Operation "Joint Edeavor": Bosnien-Herzegowina, Dezember 1995 
bis Dezember 1996
Operation "Determined Effort": Bosnien, Juli 1995 bis Dezember 
1995
Operation "Determined Falcon": Kosovo/Albanien, 15. Juni 1998 
bis 16. Juni 1998
Operation "Eagle Eye": Kosovo, 16. Oktober 1998 bis 24. M rz 1999
Operation "Sustain Hope/Allied Harbour": Kosovo, ab 5. April 1999
Operation "Shining Hope": Kosovo, ab 5. April 1999
Operation "Cobalt Flash": Kosovo, ab 23. M rz 1999
Operation "Determined Force": Kosovo, 8. Oktober 1998 bis 23. 
M rz 1999
War against Afghanistan September 2001

Is that what the US government calls peace?
I`ll think there is no more to say!
This list supplied by a man named "Franz"
       It is up to us to decide.........
        I say it is 2000 years overdue......
         From the peace of the stone circle and the tree...
                   Merlyn /|\

From: theE.S.D.
To: Merlyn
Subject: Preaching
Date: Fri Dec 28 10:51:32 2001

Message:
knock yourself out.
we've heard your sermon before.
but go right ahead.

as we said before,we are not here 
to discuss.
you might consider skipping all future
"publications" from theE.S.D.
for we won't be caught up into your sway.

theEND


From: Merlyn
To: E.S.D.
Subject: War
Date: Fri Dec 28 11:08:49 2001

Message:
Since the time of total war, we now engauge in campeigns and 
crap like the above. The Muslim extremist is trying to take the 
Koran and push the "we have our religion and they have theirs" 
Now the Extremist band wagon is filling up and will find America 
dusting off the old ways of total war. I fear India and others 
may well take the first offense. Strange... Christain religion 
was intended to be inclusive and forgiving, yet viewed very 
differently by Muslims today. The Koran has a thread of hate 
woven into every page for any one but themselves. Peaceful 
amonghst themselves, hateful to all who don't beleive Allah is 
God. I fear the few extermists need a wack up side the head from 
their own, or they will get it from everyone else very very 
soon. Also about 1600 years overdue........
              Merlyn /|\

From: theE.S.D.
To:
Subject: InTheNews
Date: Fri Dec 28 11:52:02 2001

Message:
Questions and Answers: Iraqi Opposition Leader Seyyed 
Hakim

Iran-based Hakim opposes Saddam Hussein but is 
cautious about international intervention vs. internal 
rebellion


NEWSWEEK WEB EXCLUSIVE

Dec. 26   Ayatollah Seyyed Mohammad Baqer Hakim is the 
leader of the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in 
Iraq (SCIRI), the largest Shiite political party in the country. 
The Iraqi government has accused SCIRI ofacting as Iran s 
fifth column and have jailed and executed many of its 
members since the start of Iran-Iraq war in 1980.
     
==========================

AYATOLLAH HAKIM, WHO has been living in Iran for the past 
22 years, claims that his followers are the most active 
opposition to Saddam Hussein s government working 
inside Iraq. Although Iran has repeatedly expressed its 
opposition to a military attack against Iraq as the next step in 
war against terrorism, Ayatollah Hakim welcomes 
international intervention to topple Saddam. But he says that 
 any unilateral action will remain futile.  Ayatollah Hakim is 
both highly regarded and heavily guarded in his host 
country. He takes part in most official gatherings of the 
Iranian clergy; interview requests go through an approval 
process very similar to what a high-ranking Iranian official 
would command. NEWSWEEK s Maziar Bahari met the 
ayatollah at SCIRI s compound in central Tehran.
       
       NEWSWEEK: You ve said that your ultimate goal is  to 
change the internal situation in Iraq and liberate it from the 
grip of Saddam Hussein.  How do you want to achieve that?
       Seyyed Hakim: I believe we can achieve this through 
carrying out United Nation s Security Council resolution No. 
688. This resolution was proposed to the Security Council 
by France, Turkey and the Islamic Republic of Iran after the 
gulf war in 1991. The resolution obliges the Security Council 
to interfere in case of violent suppression of civilians. But 
unfortunately this resolution has not been put in force. If the 
international community had made a firm decision in 
carrying out its obligations the Iraqi people would have been 
able to change the internal situation in Iraq. I believe the 
American secretary of State, Colin Powell with all due 
respect was wrong in saying,  the Iraqi opposition forces 
are weaker than [Afghan] Northern Alliance  and that 
 Saddam Hussein is stronger than the Taliban.  I believe 
the Iraqi opposition forces are much more organized and 
stronger than the Northern Alliance. Furthermore, Saddam s 
regime is even more unpopular than the Taliban was. 
       
       Why then have the opposition forces been unable to 
topple Saddam Hussein s government?
       Because of violent suppression of people.
       
       Where does Saddam s real strength lie?  

         [Iraq s] intelligence and information forces. The 
intelligence strata in Iraq are very complicated. There are 
many security and information organizations including 
Mokhaberat (the central information organization), Military 
Information, the Baath Party s Information Organization, etc. 
And each of these organizations has a military arm of its 
own. There are also different armies like the People s Army 
and the Quds Army, which Saddam has created as a 
gesture, as if he s going to defend the Palestinian struggle.
       
       So you need foreign interference to stop the 
suppression?
       Foreign interference led by the Security Council, not a 
unilateral decision by a single country. The international 
community has a responsibility to act against suppression. 
It already interferes in Iraq s internal affairs: it controls its 
wealth, it controls its trades, etc. So it has to act upon its 
obligation to stop the violent suppression of Iraqi people, as 
well. 
       
       Whenever we talk about international pressure it 
requires American involvement to make it a success. How 
do you feel about an American-led coalition to change the 
government in Iraq?
       The main factor here is that it is the people of Iraq who 
should play the main role. The people of Iraq are very strong 
and they are ready to topple the regime. We witnessed that 
when the people of Iraq rose up against Saddam Hussein 
after the gulf war. But the uprising was violently smashed by 
Saddam s regime. If the allied forces didn t support the 
regime the people would have definitely changed Saddam s 
government. We expect the world community to pressure 
Saddam Hussein politically and militarily to comply with 
U.N. resolutions the same way they did in Kosovo. Putting 
political pressure first, and when it proves unsuccessful, 
exert military pressure.
       
       What if the international community doesn t want to get 
involved and the Americans do it on their own? Would you 
support that?
       That depends on the political situation and timing of the 
attack. We cannot prejudge future events before they 
happen. But a unilateral decision will not take us very far.
       
       There was an article in New Yorker magazine by 
Seymour Hersh about London-based Iraq National 
Congress leader Ahmad Chalabi s claim that the 
government of Iran  has agreed to permit INC forces and 
their military equipment to cross the Iranian border into 
southern Iraq.  And that  the United States would then begin 
an intense bombing campaign, as it did in Afghanistan, and 
airlift thousands of Special Forces troops into southern 
Iraq. 
       I haven t read the article and I don t know anything about 
it. Who are the sources in the article?
       
       I guess Chalabi, the INC as well as State Department 
and CIA officials. Do you know of any deals between the INC 
and the Iranian government?
       There seems to be no agreement. You re a journalist. 
You know that sometimes people tell the press certain 
things in order to find out how others react to a certain 
hypothesis. But you have to ask where are those men who 
would carry out the operation. We would have known of 
them if they existed. Where have they hidden them so far? 
You need a real organization to lead an army prepared for 
such military operation. 
       
       How united are different opposition groups in Iraq at the 
moment?
       There is a great unity among different opposition forces 
inside and outside Iraq.
       
       What do you think about the INC and Ahmad Chalabi in 
particular? 
       I don t find it right to talk about specific groups and 
personalities. We have good relations with all opposition 
groups inside and outside Iraq. There are two kinds of Iraqi 
opposition groups. There are those groups who are active 
inside Iraq and have political and military organizations 
inside the country, namely the Supreme Council for the 
Islamic Revolution in Iraq (SCIRI), the Kurdish groups in 
northern Iraq and some other groups inside Iraq. There are 
also other opposition groups who are very active politically 
in other parts of the world. All these groups have very good 
relations with each other. Even if there are some minor 
problems they would be solved when there is a real change 
inside Iraq like what we witnessed during the gulf war. 
       
       Do all these different groups agree about the shape of 
the future government in Iraq?
       We have been negotiating with all different groups from 
different parts of the country. 
       
       How strong is SCIRI inside and outside of Iraq?
       The most active groups inside Iraq are SCIRI forces. 
SCIRI doesn t have its own military forces, but there are 
many military opposition groups inside Iraq that take 
political guidance from SCIRI. 
       
       Do you receive military and financial help from Iran? 
       Iran has welcomed us as its guests and we are thankful 
for it.
       
       How about military and financial support?
       Iran has political relations with Iraq, it doesn t interfere in 
Iraq s internal affairs and respects international laws in its 
relations with Iraq. 
       
       But there have been attacks against People s Mujahedin 
[an Iraqi-based Iranian military opposition group] inside 
Iraq s territory. Last summer there was an attack against 
their offices in Baghdad. There were reports that Iran 
financed these attacks and they were carried out by SCIRI 
forces. 
       The munafeqqin [hypocrites, a Quranic term used by the 
Iranian government to describe the mujahedin] helped 
Saddam suppress Shiite and Kurdish uprisings in 1991. 
For the opposition forces inside Iraq the munafeqqin is a 
legitimate target. People of Iraq hate them and according to 
recent reports Saddam is planning to use the munafeqqin 
in case of a future uprising. But those forces that attack the 
munafeqqin inside Iraq are not supported by Iran. The 
government of Iran doesn t even allow our forces to cross 
the border. The fact of the matter is that Saddam is trying to 
use the munafeqqin as a bargaining chip in the relations 
with Iran. He doesn t want us in Iran. He wants us to leave 
for Europe or somewhere else in world and cut our close 
ties with the people inside Iraq. 
       
       Has the fight between the United States and Iraq been 
reduced to a personal animosity with Saddam? Is it 
possible that if Saddam is toppled one of his sons, Qusai, 
Udai or another person close to him, might come to power?  
 
       Unfortunately it is possible. But the people of Iraq will 
not support changing Saddam while the structure of the 
regime remains intact. Furthermore that will not solve 
anything. But you can expect anything from the American 
government. The American government has been trying to 
get rid of Saddam Hussein for the past 10 years but it has 
not been successful. 
       
       What do you think were the United States  shortcomings 
in the past and what should it do now? 
       America should have an honest approach to the 
problems of the region. Especially regarding its total 
support of the Zionist regime [Israel], which has shattered 
America s image in the region. Also the U.S. has followed a 
wrong policy towards the Islamic Republic of Iran since the 
[1979] revolution. Regarding Iraq, America should have 
allowed the people of Iraq to decide their own future. The 
people of Iraq were close to creating their own government 
three times in the past 10 years, and each time America s 
interference blocked their efforts. After the gulf war in 1991, 
the U.S. allowed Saddam s forces to suppress the uprising 
of the people of Iraq. There was also a plan to assassinate 
Saddam and stag[e] a coup d etat, the so called  silver 
bullet  plan, in 1995. The Americans revealed this plan to 
the regime, and it was defeated. Another time different 
groups within the Iraqi Army made an agreement to stage a 
coup and change the government. This plan was also 
exposed by the Americans. And Saddam s government 
managed to assassinate Talib Al Soheil, the brain behind 
the plan, in Beirut. 
       
       Some American politicians were afraid that another 
Islamic Republic, like Iran, would come to power in Iraq if 
Saddam was defeated.
       But that was not the main reason that the gulf war 
coalition allowed Saddam to suppress the uprising. Many 
Americans confessed that it was a collective decision of 
some countries in the region.
       
       Which ones?
       Some of them. I know that [Egyptian president] Mr. Hosni 
Mubarak said that we didn t want a change of government. 
What you just mentioned is a wrong assumption by some 
American politicians. Before the gulf war, SCIRI and 26 
other Iraqi opposition groups took part in a conference in 
Damascus in January 1990. In that conference after months 
of negotiations we reached an agreement that after 
Saddam s regime, there will be a multiparty parliamentarian 
interim government for one year. After that there would be a 
referendum about the future government of Iraq. We decided 
that Iraq should rid itself of weapons of mass destruction, 
should have friendly relations with neighboring countries, 
and should respect international laws. The U.S. and the rest 
of the world knew about the outcome of the conference and 
our agreement. 
       
       Do all 27 groups still respect this agreement? 
       Yes we do. There have been subsequent meetings in 
other places and we have insisted on the validity of the 
agreement reached in Damascus in 1990. One of the most 
important issues in the agreement is the unity of Iraq. 
Saddam is trying to imply that after him there will be a 
break-up. But it is just a ploy to scare the world community 
regarding the consequences of his fall. The truth is that 
there are Shiites, Kurds and Sunnis all over Iraq so the idea 
of a break-up is just an illusionary threat created by 
Saddam s government. Furthermore I don t think the world 
community nor the countries of the region would agree with 
the break-up of Iraq into three parts. 

*  *  *  *  *

============================
OnLineNews: 
http://www.msnbc.com/news/677070.asp?cp1=1#BODY
============================
Arafat is a Traitor

The Palestinian leader finally persuades Hamas and 
Islamic Jihad to call off their suicide bombers and stop 
shelling Jewish settlements. But lasting peace seems no 
closer

From: theE.S.D.
To:
Subject: InTheNews
Date: Fri Dec 28 11:57:57 2001

Message:
======================

12/28/2001 : "The U.S. Must Strike at Saddam Hussein" 

Within hours of the Sept. 11 attacks, President Bush said, 
"We will make no distinction between the terrorists who 
committed these acts and those who harbor them." From 
that first statement, Mr. Bush shaped a grand strategy for the 
war on terrorism that is as transforming of American policy 
as was Ronald Reagan's pledge to consign an "evil empire" 
to the "ash heap of history." It breaks with the past by taking 
aim at states harboring terrorists as well as at terrorists 
themselves. It is why we have destroyed the Taliban regime 
in Afghanistan even as we hunt down Osama bin Laden 
himself. It is why the war against terrorism cannot be won if 
Saddam Hussein continues to rule Iraq. 

Three things about Saddam Hussein make the destruction 
of his regime essential to the war against terrorism 

First, like Osama bin Laden, Saddam Hussein hates the 
United States with a vengeance he expresses at every 
opportunity. It is hatred intensified by a tribal culture of the 
blood feud   one that he has embraced since Mr. Bush's 
father defeated him on the field of battle.

Second, Saddam Hussein has an array of chemical and 
biological weapons and has been willing to absorb the pain 
of a decade-long embargo rather than allow international 
inspectors to uncover the full magnitude of his program. The 
expulsion of inspectors from Iraq three years ago has 
rendered future inspections worthless; everything that could 
be relocated has been moved and hidden in mosques, 
schools, hospitals, farms, private homes. These programs 
  now involving dozens, perhaps hundreds, of clandestine 
sites   will prove even more difficult to find than Osama bin 
Laden.

Alone among heads of state, he has actually used chemical 
weapons against his own people, killing thousands of 
unarmed citizens in northern Iraq. We know that he has 
produced quantities of anthrax sufficient to kill millions of 
people, as well as other biological agents. Disseminated to 
would-be martyrs from Al Qaeda, Hezbollah, Hamas, 
Islamic Jihad or other terrorist groups, Saddam Hussein's 
biological arsenal could kill very large numbers of 
Americans.

With each passing day, he comes closer to his dream of a 
nuclear arsenal. We know he has a clandestine program, 
spread over many hidden sites, to enrich Iraqi natural 
uranium to weapons grade. We know he has the designs 
and the technical staff to fabricate nuclear weapons once he 
obtains the material. And intelligence sources know he is in 
the market, with plenty of money, for both weapons material 
and components as well as finished nuclear weapons. How 
close is he? We do not know. Two years, three years, 
tomorrow even? We simply do not know, and any 
intelligence estimate that would cause us to relax would be 
about as useful as the ones that missed his nuclear 
program in the early 1990's or failed to predict the Indian 
nuclear test in 1998 or to gain even a hint of the Sept. 11 
attack.

Third, we know that Saddam Hussein has engaged directly 
in acts of terror and given sanctuary and other support to 
terrorists. In 1993 he planned the assassination of George 
H. W. Bush during the former president's visit to Kuwait. He 
operates a terrorist training facility at Salman Pak complete 
with a passenger aircraft cabin for training in hijacking.

His collaboration with terrorists is well documented. 
Evidence of a meeting in Prague between a senior Iraqi 
intelligence agent and Mohamed Atta, the Sept. 11 
ringleader, is convincing. More important is his long, 
continuing collaboration with a number of terrorist groups, 
some of whose leaders live in and operate from Iraq. He 
openly, defiantly pays the families of suicide bombers and 
praises the attacks on Sept. 11. If anyone fits the profile of 
support for terror, it is Saddam Hussein.

Saddam Hussein's removal from office, we are told 
privately, would be cheered in the Persian Gulf. The 
conventional wisdom that an attack on him would be seen 
as an attack against Islam is an insult to Islam, and it is 
wrong. To most Muslims, his reign of terror is an 
abomination. In Iraq itself, his downfall would be met with 
dancing in the streets. A decent successor regime would be 
very likely to encourage peace in the region.

The charter of the Iraqi National Congress, an umbrella 
group of Saddam Hussein's opponents, calls for 
eradicating weapons of mass destruction and renouncing 
terrorism. Those opponents need our political and financial 
support today, and when the time is ripe, they will need our 
precision air power. 

In 1981 the Israelis faced an urgent choice: Should they 
allow Saddam Hussein to fuel a French-built nuclear reactor 
near Baghdad   or destroy it? Once fuel was placed in the 
reactor, it could not be bombed without releasing lethal 
radioactive material. Allowing the fueling to go forward 
meant that the Baghdad regime could eventually get the 
plutonium to build a nuclear weapon. The Israelis decided 
to strike pre-emptively, before it was too late: in a 
spectacular display of precision bombing, the reactor at 
Osirak was destroyed.

Everything we know about Saddam Hussein forces 
President Bush to make a similar choice: to take 
pre-emptive action or wait, possibly until it is too late. We 
waited too long before acting broadly against terrorism. We 
were too late to save the victims of Sept. 11. We should have 
taken terrorism seriously three years ago, when our 
embassies in East Africa were destroyed. To leave Saddam 
Hussein in place and hope for the best would repeat that 
mistake. And narrowing the war against terror to exclude his 
regime would drain a bold and courageous policy of its 
great and vital strength.

By RICHARD PERLE
Richard Perle, a fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, 
was assistant secretary of defense from 1981 to 1987.
Source:Washiington 

======================


From: theE.S.D.
To:
Subject: BackIssues
Date: Fri Dec 28 12:00:20 2001

Message:
The Six-Day War and its Aftermath

Today, it is hard to recapture the feelings that existed before 
the Six-Day War. At that time, people everywhere - including 
most of the Jewish community inside and outside Israel - 
sincerely believed the Arab threats to push Israel into the 
sea. They felt that it was only a matter of time before those 
threats would be carried out. As the war drew nearer and 
nearer, their premonitions of dread continued to increase.

The Rebbe, in contrast, radiated strength and confidence. 
Before the war, he made both public and private statements, 
stating that this was a period of unique Divine favor for the 
Jewish people, and promising that they would soon be 
rewarded by wondrous miracles. When American students 
in Israel were streaming to the airport by the thousands, the 
Rebbe told his followers to stay in the Holy Land, assuring 
them that they did not face any danger.

Immediately after the war was concluded, the Rebbe began 
to speak out against the return of the territories Israel had 
conquered. At that point, no one could appreciate what the 
Rebbe meant. Never in world history had any one ever 
thought of returning land won in a defensive war.

And yet, shortly after the war, a state delegation from 
Jerusalem arrived in Washington and told the Americans to 
advise the Arabs that Israel was prepared to give back the 
land she had conquered in exchange for peace.At first the 
Americans were amazed; they did not believe what they 
were hearing. But when the Israelis repeated their 
promises, they communicated the message. The Arabs, 
flabbergasted, had not dreamed that Israel would ever 
consider giving away these territories. The Americans, 
however, assured them that the Israelis meant what they 
said.

Why didn't the Arabs agree? Because at that time, they could 
not contemplate giving even lip service to the concept of 
peace. So powerful was their hatred that they could not 
publicly state that they would end their aggression against 
Israel.And yet, the fact that they digested the Israeli 
message was harmful. From that moment, they launched a 
diplomatic campaign calling for the return of the land that 
Israel had conquered. Had Israel not made these offers, the 
Arabs would never have contemplated making such 
demands.

A similar pattern could be seen with regard to the Arabs 
living in the West Bank. Directly after the war, the majority of 
the Arabs wanted to flee to the other Arab countries. Many 
others would have gladly done so had they been offered 
some financial recompense. At that point in time, the other 
Arab countries would have accepted them. They would have 
had no choice. And yet Israel's leaders closed the borders 
and prevented these Arabs from leaving.

At that time, Israel's government explained that they were 
encouraging the Arabs to stay because they wanted to show 
the world a shining example of coexistence between 
nations. What shortsightedness! Had they left, the Intifada, 
the demographic problem, and all the sensitive issues that 
a large Arab population in the West Bank creates would 
never have arisen. And any significant reduction in the Arab 
population would have diminished the magnitude of these 
problems.

Nor is shortsightedness the only difficulty. The greater 
reason for having the Arabs stay was that Israel's 
self-image was not strong enough to see herself settling 
the entire land and maintaining possession. Although from 
a security perspective this is vital for the country's future, the 
Israeli government lacked the inner resolve to make this 
commitment to the country's tomorrow.

Instead, the government restricted Jewish settlement in the 
Old City of Jerusalem and throughout the West Bank. Rather 
than create a situation which would have made the unity of 
the holy city and the continued possession of the West Bank 
a logical necessity, the Israeli government always treated 
the land as "occupied territory." Indeed, this conception was 
continually reinforced by government communiqu s and the 
official government news media, which always referred to 
the West Bank as hashtachim ("the territories"), instead of 
the Hebrew names for Judea (Yehudah) and Samaria 
(Shomron). Moreover, the government always treated the 
Arabs as the rightful owners of the land, clearly indicating 
that a just settlement of the issue would involve an Israeli 
withdrawal.

From the outset, the Rebbe called for settlement of the 
entire land, emphasizing that not only from a spiritual 
perspective, but also from a security perspective, the Land 
of Israel is a single, indivisible entity. He did not see the 
government's program of partial settlement as a solution, 
for it placed the settlers in danger, and never reflected a 
sincere commitment to command authority over the land in 
its entirety.

http://www.truepeace.org/sixday.html

also: http://www.i-cias.com/e.o/sixdaywr.htm

==============================

From: Merlyn
To: E.S.D.
Subject: News
Date: Fri Dec 28 12:14:41 2001

Message:
If I want to read the news, I'll do so. You seem to feel 
compelled to fill this site with such. This is a discussion 
forum. I don't push my agenda on you, but you feel you have the 
right to spew news all over this site. We all know Saddam is a 
nut case and a danger. You might just as well skip all opinion 
in your reading from this site as well.
            The End?? indeed!
         

From: North Carolina Gal
To: the E.S.D
Subject: thanks
Date: Fri Dec 28 12:24:23 2001

Message:
In times like we have now,I appreciate all the food for thought 
I can get....Thanks

From: om/cf
To: the E.S.D & Merlyn
Date: Fri Dec 28 13:26:40 2001

Message:
NEWS:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1731000/17
31229.stm

Friday, 28 December, 2001, 13:42 GMT
 
Shoe bomb 'came from Netherlands'

Mr Reid is reported to have told the Federal Bureau of 
Investigation that he bought explosives in Amsterdam for $1,500 
and that he found the sellers via the internet. 

=================================================================
====

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2001/9/24/134111.shtml

International Terrorist Support Groups Thrive in Belgium and 
Netherlands 

Adriana Stuijt
Monday, Sept. 24, 2001 

ROTTERDAM   Top international anti-terrorism experts have 
identified two of Europe's most legally tolerant regions   
namely, the Dutch-language areas around Europe's most important 
west coast harbors, Antwerp and Rotterdam   as the main breeding 
ground for Muslim-fundamentalist terrorist groups. Osama bin 
Laden 's organization even runs shipping companies as fronts 
from Amsterdam................................................. 
=================================================================
=================================================================
============

OPINION:

 I appreciate the news and links provided by the E.S.D. I also 
enjoy reading your posts too Merlyn, you lose me on the Asrology 
and rock circle type of stuff, but I usually see your point. 
Variety is the spice of life, so I've heard.
   By the way E.S.D., Im looking at a article in a small, local, 
and (choking sounds) liberal free paper titled, Troops massing 
on Iraqi border? It says the Daily Telegraph in London is 
reporting 20,000 troops have been stationed in Qatar and Kuwait
to make Saddam nervous and to bolster Saddams opposition. Im off 
to find out more.




From: Merlyn
To: E.S.D.
Subject: Opinion
Date: Fri Dec 28 14:54:00 2001

Message:
Most profoundly I admit.. a bit hasty, a retort. Your work is 
overwhelming though. Normally don't let others get me out of 
focus. The religon thing gets me a bit fumed due to the results. 
Your input is constructive, and for that I applaud.
          Merlyn 
Any constructive work is worth while and the format for peace.
           

From: theE.S.D.
To: Merlyn
Date: Fri Dec 28 15:10:00 2001

Message:
Peace

From: theE.S.D.
To: om/cf
Date: Fri Dec 28 16:22:58 2001

Message:
we have heard of some activity along the
Iraqi and Kuwaiti boarder,but have not heard
of that particular report you cited.

thank-you for the information.
we will keep an eye out.

=======================
we do have the following report in the "bin".

12/27/2001 : "U.S. Dismisses Iraqi 'No Fly' Zone Hit Claim" 

The Defense Department dismissed as baseless on 
Wednesday an Iraqi claim that it hit a coalition aircraft 
enforcing a ``no-fly'' zone in southern Iraq.
``We were flying over the southern no-fly zone today but all 
planes returned safely to base (with) no indication that any 
were hit,'' said Navy Lt. Cmdr. Jeff Davis, a Pentagon 
spokesman.
``Iraq has been known to make false claims in the past,'' he 
said. Davis said he was speaking for both the United States 
and Britain, which also patrols the exclusion zones in the 
north and south of Iraq.
Earlier on Wednesday, Baghdad said its anti-aircraft 
defenses had hit one of a group of Western planes 
patrolling the southern no-fly area.
``Brave Iraqi men in the missile forces hit one of the 
enemy's planes,'' the Iraqi News Agency quoted a military 
spokesman as saying.
The zones were set up 10 years ago to protect the areas' 
ethnic Kurdish and Shi'ite peoples after a U.S.-led coalition 
drove Iraq from Kuwait. 

Source:WASHINGTON (Reuters) 

=======================



From: an Italian guy
To: Merlyn
Subject: answer
Date: Fri Dec 28 16:19:28 2001

Message:
"Is that what the US government calls peace?"
No, those are called wars, the situations after those wars are 
called peace.
Allenfalls, bist du Deutsch, Merlyn?

From: theE.S.D.
To:
Subject: OnLineHistory
Date: Fri Dec 28 16:59:52 2001

Message:
http://www.historyguy.com/serial_wars_and_conflicts.html

http://www.historyguy.com/War_list.html

http://www.historyguy.com/american_military_history.html

From: Merlyn
To: An Italian guy
Subject: War
Date: Fri Dec 28 17:35:31 2001

Message:
Yes,, I know. but they just keep on going and going like the 
energizer bunny! I don't recall peace, born in '58. Never can 
say we were at peace, really. When I welcomed back those from 
Nam, others were spitting on the ground. When I saw Kennedy shot 
I was watching. It just never ends... Proud of America I am and 
would die for it, but tired of war I am, very. Can't speak 
German but I am learning Welsh. I wrote in McCain, can't stand 
Gore, I knew when Bush got elected, skeletons from the closet 
would come out. Just tired of Jews & Muslims fighting over 
Palistine. Both think they are Divine... neither has a clue. 
Stuck in the muck again, it's hard to stay calm and keep hate 
from guiding decisions that need clear thought. 
  But all this aside, if they keep pushing it...they will be 
getting IT! Might not be from America, they best watch their 
ass..India is hot! Osama is not. 

From: Spy
To: Merlyn
Subject: humor
Date: Fri Dec 28 18:14:55 2001

Message:
What do ya get when you put the battery in backwards on the 
energizer bunny?

From: theE.S.D.
To: om/cf
Subject: "liberal free paper"
Date: Fri Dec 28 18:54:13 2001

Message:
do you have a name of the paper?

From: Merlyn
To: Spy
Subject: Bunny
Date: Fri Dec 28 20:17:02 2001

Message:
A bunny that keeps coming and coming. 
But on a more current note; 
 The USA ski team was trying out for the olympics in China. One 
skier from West Virginia was kicked off the team. Dumb as a 
brick but a good skier. He was asked. "why were you 
disqualified?"
He replyed "because I kept hitting the slopes" 
Yes it's a baaaaaaaaaaaad joke. but hey it's new!

From: Spy
To: Merlyn
Subject: "give that man a cupid doll----("cupy doll?")
Date: Fri Dec 28 20:40:27 2001

Message:
thanks --had fun today.

From: om/cf
To: theE.S.D
Date: Fri Dec 28 20:23:09 2001

Message:
http://www.rockrivertimes.com/

 I always pick one up at the grocery store because Im a tightwad!
Its very conspiracy orientated and usually has one marijuana 
legalization article. Not exactly stuff I agree with, but its
fun to read other views on things. They operate out of a small
downtown storefront and have had their windows busted out more 
than once over articles they printed!
 I had to use the search the U.K. Telegraph site.

http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=%2Fnews%
2F2001%2F12%2F20%2Fwar20.xml
 
US build-up in the Middle East
By Peter Green in Prague and Michael Smith
(Filed: 20/12/2001) 



From: theE.S.D.
To:
Subject: InTheNews
Date: Sat Dec 29 09:54:34 2001

Message:
====================================

Mideast 
Israel Accuses Iran Plan to Destroy Jewish State with 
Nuclear Weapons
VOA News
29 Dec 2001 05:10 UTC  

Israel says it fears Iran is planning to develop nuclear 
weapons to annihilate the Jewish state. 

In a letter Friday to Secretary general Kofi Annan, Israeli 
Foreign Minister Shimon Peres said an influential group of 
Iranians is planning Israel's destruction. 

Mr. Peres referred to a December 14 speech by former 
Iranian President Ali Akbar Rafsanjani when he said the 
Islamic world was seeking atomic bombs to destroy Israel 
and undermine Western influence in the Middle East. 

Mr. Peres says the speech is a clear sign of Iranian hatred 
for Israel and its declared goal to wipe it out. 

He is asking for U.N. help in pressuring Iran to give up its 
nuclear program. 

Iran has not yet responded to the Peres letter, but has 
always said its nuclear program is strictly for peaceful 
purposes. 


Some information for this report provided by Reuters and 
DPA. 
-------------------------
more on this story can be found online:
http://www.nationalpost.com/home/story.html?f=/stories/200
11229/990558.html

=============================
OnLineNews:

Why Islam appeals to prisoners
http://www.nationalpost.com/commentary/story.html?f=/stori
es/20011229/990690.html


======================

From: FrontLines
To: USA goy enslaved victims
Subject: Israel's Assault against USA
Date: Sat Dec 29 11:46:21 2001

Message:
Probes Espionage at White House

By J. Michael Waller <waller@insightmag.com>
and Paul M. Rodriguez <rodriguez@insightmag.com>

A foreign spy service appears to have penetrated secret 
communications in
the Clinton administration, which has discounted security and 
intelligence
threats.

The FBI is probing an explosive foreign-espionage operation that 
could
dwarf the other spy scandals plaguing the U.S. government. 
Insight has
learned that FBI counterintelligence is tracking a daring 
operation to spy
on high-level U.S. officials by hacking into supposedly secure 
telephone
networks. The espionage was facilitated, federal officials say, 
by lax
telephone-security procedures at the White House, State 
Department and
other high-level government offices and by a Justice Department
unwillingness to seek an indictment against a suspect.

The espionage operation may have serious ramifications because 
the FBI has
identified Israel as the culprit. It risks undermining U.S. 
public support
for the Jewish state at a time Israel is seeking billions of tax 
dollars
for the return of land to Syria. It certainly will add to 
perceptions that
the Clinton-Gore administration is not serious about national 
security.
Most important, it could further erode international confidence 
in the
ability of the United States to keep secrets and effectively 
lead as the
world's only superpower.

More than two dozen U.S. intelligence, counterintelligence, law-
enforcement
and other officials have told Insight that the FBI believes 
Israel has
intercepted telephone and modem communications on some of the 
most
sensitive lines of the U.S. government on an ongoing basis. The 
worst
penetrations are believed to be in the State Department. But 
others say the
supposedly secure telephone systems in the White House, Defense 
Department
and Justice Department may have been compromised as well.

The problem for FBI agents in the famed Division 5, however, 
isn't just
what they have uncovered, which is substantial, but what they 
don't yet
know, according to Insight's sources interviewed during a year-
long
investigation by the magazine. Of special concern is how to 
confirm and
deal with the potentially sweeping espionage penetration of key 
U.S.
government telecommunications systems allowing foreign 
eavesdropping on
calls to and from the White House, the National Security 
Council, or NSC,
the Pentagon and the State Department.

The directors of the FBI and the CIA have been kept informed of 
the ongoing
counterintelligence operation, as have the president and top 
officials at
the departments of Defense, State and Justice and the NSC. 
A "heads up" has
been given to the House and Senate Intelligence Committees, but 
no
government official would speak for the record.

"It's a huge security nightmare," says a senior U.S. official 
familiar with =
the
super-secret counterintelligence operation. "The implications 
are severe,"
confirms a second with direct knowledge. "We're not even sure we 
know the
extent of it," says a third high-ranking intelligence 
official. "All I can
tell you is that we think we know how it was done," this third 
intelligence
executive tells Insight. "That alone is serious enough, but it's 
the
unknown that has such deep consequences."

A senior government official who would go no further than to 
admit
awareness of the FBI probe, says: "It is a politically sensitive 
matter. I
can't comment on it beyond telling you that anything involving 
Israel on
this particular matter is off-limits. It's that hot."

It is very hot indeed. For nearly a year, FBI agents had been 
tracking an
Israeli
businessman working for a local phone company. The man's wife is 
alleged to
be a Mossad officer under diplomatic cover at the Israeli 
Embassy in
Washington. Mossad - the Israeli intelligence service - is known 
to station
husband-and-wife teams abroad, but it was not known whether the 
husband is
a full-fledged officer, an agent or something else. When federal 
agents
made a search of his work area they found a list of the FBI's 
most
sensitive telephone numbers, including the Bureau's "black" 
lines used for
wiretapping. Some of the listed numbers were lines that FBI
counterintelligence used to keep track of the suspected Israeli 
spy
operation. The hunted were tracking the
hunters.

"It was a shock," says an intelligence professional familiar 
with the FBI
phone list.

"It called into question the entire operation. We had been 
compromised. But
for how long?"

This discovery by Division 5 should have come as no surprise, 
given what its
agents had been tracking for many months. But the FBI discovered 
enough
information to make it believe that, somehow, the highest levels 
of the
State Department were compromised, as well as the White House 
and the NSC.
According to Insight's sources with direct knowledge, other 
secure
government telephone systems and/or phones to which government 
officials
called also appear to have been compromised.

The tip-off about these operations - the pursuit of which 
sometimes has led
the FBI on some wild-goose chases - appears to have come from 
the CIA, says
an Insight source. A local phone manager had become suspicious 
in late 1996
or early 1997 about activities by a subcontractor working on 
phone-billing
software and hardware designs for the CIA.

The subcontractor was employed by an Israeli-based company and 
cleared for
such work. But suspicious behavior raised red flags. After a 
fairly quick
review, the CIA handed the problem to the FBI for follow-up. 
This was not
the first time the FBI had been asked to investigate such 
matters and,
though it was politically explosive because it involved Israel, 
Division 5
ran with the ball. "This is always a sensitive issue for the 
Bureau," says
a former U.S. intelligence officer. "When it has anything to do 
with
Israel, it's something you just never want to poke your nose 
into. But this
one had too much potential to ignore because it involved a 
potential
systemwide penetration."

Seasoned counterintelligence veterans are not surprised. "The 
Israelis condu=
ct
intelligence as if they are at war. That's something we have to 
realize,"
says David Major, a retired FBI supervisory special agent and 
former
director of counterintelligence at the NSC. While the U.S. 
approach to
intelligence is much more relaxed, says Major, the very 
existence of Israel
is threatened and it regards itself as is in a permanent state 
of war.
"There are a lot less handcuffs on intelligence for a nation 
that sees
itself at war," Major observes, but "that doesn't excuse it from 
our
perspective."

=46or years, U.S. intelligence chiefs have worried about moles 
burrowed into
their agencies, but detecting them was fruitless. The activities 
of Israeli
spy Jonathan Pollard were uncovered by accident, but there 
remains
puzzlement to this day as to how he was able to ascertain which 
documents
to search, how he did so on so many occasions without detection, 
or how he
ever obtained the security clearances that opened the doors to 
such
secrets. In all, it is suspected, Pollard turned over to his 
Israeli
handlers about 500,000 documents, including photographs, names 
and
locations of overseas agents.

"The damage was incredible," a current U.S. intelligence officer 
tells
Insight. "We're still recovering from it."

Also there has been concern for years that a mole was operating 
in the NSC
and, while not necessarily supplying highly secret materials to 
foreign
agents, has been turning over precious details on meetings and 
policy
briefings that are being used to track or otherwise monitor 
government
activities.

The current hush-hush probe by the FBI, and what its agents 
believe to be a
serious but amorphous security breach involving telephone and 
modem lines
that are being monitored by Israeli agents, has even more serious
ramifications. "It has been an eye opener," says one high-
ranking U.S.
government official, shaking his head in horror as to the 
potential level
and scope of penetration.

As for how this may have been done technologically, the FBI 
believes it has
uncovered a means using telephone-company equipment at remote 
sites to
track calls placed to or received from high-ranking government 
officials,
possibly including the president himself, according to Insight's 
top-level
sources. One of the methods suspected is use of a private 
company that
provides record-keeping software and support services for major 
telephone
utilities in the United States.

A local telephone company director of security Roger Kochman 
tells Insight, =
"I
don't know anything about it, which would be highly unusual. I 
am not
familiar with anything in that area."

U.S. officials believe that an Israeli penetration of that 
telephone
utility in the
Washington area was coordinated with a penetration of agents 
using another
telephone support-services company to target select telephone 
lines.
Suspected penetration includes lines and systems at the White 
House and
NSC, where it is believed that about four specific phones were 
monitored -
either directly or through remote sites that may involve numbers 
dialed
from the complex.

"[The FBI] uncovered what appears to be a sophisticated means to 
listen in o=
n
conversations from remote telephone sites with capabilities of 
providing
real-time audio feeds directly to Tel Aviv," says a U.S. 
official familiar
with the FBI investigation. Details of how this could have been 
pulled off
are highly guarded. However, a high-level U.S. intelligence 
source tells
Insight: "The access had to be done in such a way as to evade our
countermeasures =8A That's what's most disconcerting."

Another senior U.S. intelligence source adds: "How long this has 
been going
on is something we don't know. How many phones or telephone 
systems we
don't know either, but the best guess is that it's no more than 
24 at a
time =8A as far as we can tell."

And has President Clinton been briefed? "Yes, he has. After all, 
he's had
meetings with his Israeli counterparts," says a senior U.S. 
official with
direct knowledge. Whether the president or his national-security 
aides,
including NSC chief Sandy Berger, have shared or communicated 
U.S.
suspicions and alarm is unclear, as is the matter of any Israeli 
response.
"This is the first I've heard of it," White House National 
Security Council
spokesman Dave Stockwell tells Insight. "That doesn't mean it 
doesn't exist
or that someone else doesn't know."

Despite elaborate precautions by the U.S. agencies involved, say 
Insight's
sources, this alleged Israeli intelligence coup came down to the 
weakest
link in the security chain: the human element. The technical key 
appears to
be software designs for telephone billing records and support 
equipment
required for interfacing with local telephone company hardware 
installed in
some federal agencies. The FBI has deduced that it was this 
sophisticated
computer-related equipment and software could provide real-time 
audio
feeds. In fact, according to Insight's sources, the FBI believes 
that at
least one
secure T-1 line routed to Tel Aviv has been used in the 
suspected espionage.

The potential loss of U.S. secrets is incalculable. So is the 
possibility
that senior U.S. officials could be blackmailed for indiscreet 
telephone
talk. Many officials do not like to bother with using secure, 
encrypted
phones and have classified discussions on open lines.

Which brings the story back to some obvious questions involving 
the indiscre=
et
telephone conversations of the president himself. Were they 
tapped, and, if
so did they involve national-security issues or just matters of 
the flesh?
Monica Lewinsky told Kenneth Starr, as recounted in his report 
to Congress,
that Lewinsky and Clinton devised cover stories should their 
trysts be
uncovered and/or their phone-sex capers be overheard.

Specifically, she said that on March 29, 1997, she and Clinton 
were huddled
in the Oval Office suite engaging in a sexual act. It was not 
the first
time. But, according to Lewinsky as revealed under oath to the
investigators for the Office of Independent Counsel, it was 
unusual because
of what the president told her. "He suspected that a foreign 
embassy was
tapping his telephones, and he proposed cover stories," the 
Starr report
says. "If ever questioned, she should say that the two of them 
were just
friends. If anyone ever asked about their phone sex, she should 
say that
they knew their calls were being monitored all along, and the 
phone sex was
just a put on."  In his own testimony before a federal grand 
jury, Clinton
denied the incident. But later - much later - he admitted to 
improper
behavior and was impeached but not
convicted. U.S. District Court Judge Susan Webber Wright found 
him to have
obstructed justice. Curiously, Starr never informed Congress 
whether the
Lewinsky tale was true. For that matter, according to Insight's 
sources,
Starr never bothered to find out from appropriate agencies, such 
as the FBI
or the CIA, whether the monitoring by a foreign government of the
president's conversations with Lewinsky occurred.

Insight has learned that House and Senate investigators did ask 
questions ab=
out
these matters and in late 1998 were told directly by the FBI and 
the CIA
(among others) that there was no truth to the Lewinsky claim of 
foreign
tapping of White House phones. Moreover, Congress was told there 
was no
investigation of any kind involving any foreign embassy or 
foreign
government espionage in such areas.

But that was not true. In fact, the FBI and other U.S. agencies, 
including t=
he
Pentagon, had been working furiously and painstakingly for well 
over a year
on just such a secret probe, and fears were rampant of the 
damage that
could ensue if the American public found out that even the 
remotest
possibility existed that the president's phone conversations 
could be
monitored and the president subject to foreign blackmail. To the 
FBI agents
involved, that chance seemed less and less remote.

The FBI has become increasingly frustrated by both the pace of 
its
investigation and its failure to gain Justice Department 
cooperation to
seek an indictment of at least one individual suspected of 
involvement in
the alleged Israeli telephone intercepts. National security is 
being
invoked to cover an espionage outrage. But, as a high law-
enforcement
source says, "To bring this to trial would require we reveal our 
methods of
operation, and we can't do that at this point - the FBI has not 
made the
case strong enough." Moreover, says a senior U.S. policy 
official with
knowledge of the case: "This is a hugely political issue, not 
just a
law-enforcement matter."

'You've Got the Crown Jewels'

If spies wanted to penetrate the White House, a facility widely 
considered
the most secure in the world, how might it be done? For that 
matter, how
might any agency or department of government be penetrated by 
spies?

"Actually, it's pretty easy if you know what you're doing," says 
a retired
U.S. intelligence expert who has helped (along with other 
government
sources) to guide Insight through the many and often complicated 
pathways
of government security and counterespionage.

Access to designs, databases, "blueprints," memos, telephone 
numbers, lists
of personnel and passwords all can be obtained. And from 
surprising
sources. Several years ago this magazine was able to review from 
a remote
site information on the supposedly secret and inaccessible White 
House
Office Data Base, or WHODB (see "More Personal Secrets on File @ 
the White
House," July 15, 1996).

Despite the spending of additional millions to beef up security 
when the Whi=
te
House installed a modern $30 million computerized telephone 
system a few
years ago, communications security remains a big problem. 
Whatever the
level of sophistication employed, there are soft underbellies 
that raise
significant national-security problems. And potential for 
espionage, such
as electronic intercepting of phone calls, is very great.

Calls to or from the White House dealing with classified 
information are
supposed to be handled on secure lines, but it doesn't always 
happen.
Sometimes, according to Insight's sources, despite the existence 
of special
phones at the White House and elsewhere to handle such calls, 
some don't
use them or only one side of the call does. An Insight editor 
recently was
allowed for demonstration purposes to overhear a conversation 
placed over
an unsecured line involving a "classified" topic.

Carelessness always has been a problem, but former and current 
FBI special
agents say that under the Clinton administration the disregard 
for security
has been epidemic. Many officials simply don't like the bother of
communicating on secure phones.

In another instance, Insight was provided access to virtually 
every telephon=
e
number within the White House, including those used by outside 
agencies with
employees in the complex, and even the types of computers used 
and who uses
them. Just by way of illustration, this information allowed 
direct access
to communications instruments located in the Oval Office, the 
residence,
bathrooms and grounds.

With such information, according to security and intelligence 
experts, a
hacker or spy could target individual telephone lines and write 
software
codes enabling the conversations to be forwarded in real-time 
for remote
recording and transcribing. The White House complex contains 
approximately
5,800 voice, fax and modem lines.

"Having a phone number in and of itself will not necessarily 
gain you
access for monitoring purposes," Insight was told by a senior 
intelligence
official with regular contact at the White House. "The systems 
are designed
to electronically mask routes and generate secure connections." 
That said,
coupling a known phone number to routing sequences and trunk 
lines would
pose a security risk, this official says.

Add to that detailed knowledge of computer codes used to move 
call traffic
and your hacker or spy is in a very strong position. "That's why 
we have so
many redundancies and security devices on the systems - so we 
can tell if
someone is trying to hack in," says a current security official 
at the
White House.

Shown a sampling of the hoard of data collected over just a few 
months of
digging, the security official's face went flush: "How the hell 
did you get
that! This is what we are supposed to guard against. This is not 
supposed
to be public."

Indeed. Nor should the telephone numbers or locations of remote 
sites or
trunk lines or other sundry telecommunications be accessible. 
What's
surprising is that most of this specialized information reviewed 
by Insight
is unclassified in its separate pieces. When you put it 
together, the
solved puzzle is considered a national-security secret. And for 
very good
reason.

Consider the following: Insight not only was provided secure 
current phone
numbers to the most sensitive lines in the world, but it 
discovered a
remote telephone site in the Washington area which plugs into 
the White
House telecommunications system.

Given national-security concerns, Insight has been asked not to 
divulge any
telephone number, location of high-security equipment, or 
similar data not
directly necessary for this news story.

Concerning the remote telecommunications site, Insight 
discovered not only i=
ts
location and access telephone numbers but other information, 
including the
existence of a secret "back door" to the computer system that 
had been left
open for upward of two years without anyone knowing about the 
security
lapse. This back door, common to large computer systems, is used 
for a
variety of services, including those involving technicians, 
supervisors,
contractors and security officers to run diagnostic checks, make 
repairs
and review system operations.

"This is more than just a technical blunder," says a well-placed 
source
with detailed knowledge of White House security issues. "This is 
a very
serious security failure with unimaginable consequences. Anyone 
could have
accessed that [back door] and gotten into the entire White House 
phone
system and obtained numbers and passwords that we never could 
track," the
source said, echoing yet another source familiar with the issue.

Although it is not the responsibility of the Secret Service to 
manage equipm=
ent
systems, the agency does provide substantial security controls 
over
telecommunications and support service into or out of the White 
House. In
fact, the Secret Service maintains its own electronic devices on 
the phone
system to help protect against penetration. "That's what is so 
troubling
about this," says a security expert with ties to the White 
House. "There
are redundant systems to catch such errors and this was not 
caught. It's
quite troubling.=8A It's not supposed to happen."

Insight asked a senior federal law-enforcement official with 
knowledge of th=
e
suspected Israeli spying case about the open electronic door. "I 
didn't
know about this incident. It certainly is something we should 
have known
given the scope of what's at stake," the official says.

Then Insight raised the matter of obtaining phone numbers, 
routing systems,
equipment sites, passwords and other data on the 
telecommunications systems
used by the White House: How hard would it be for a foreign 
intelligence
service to get this information? "Obviously not as hard as we 
thought," a
senior government official said. "Now you understand what we're 
facing and
why we are so concerned."

That's one reason, Insight is told, the White House phone system 
is designed=
 to
 mask all outgoing calls to prevent outsiders from tracing back 
into the
system to set up taps. However, knowing the numbers called 
frequently by
the White House, foreign agents could set up listening devices 
on those
lines to capture incoming or outgoing calls. Another way of 
doing it,
according to security experts, is to get inside the White House 
system.
And, though it's considered impossible, that's what they said 
about getting
the phone numbers that the president uses in his office and 
residence.

Like trash, information is everywhere - and often is overlooked 
when trying =
to
tidy up a mess.

- PMR and JMW


'So What, It's Only Israel!'

There is a tendency in and out of government to minimize the 
impact of Israe=
li
espionage against the United States because Israel is a friendly 
country.
That overlooks the gravity of the espionage threat, says David 
Major,
former director of counterintelligence programs at the National 
Security
Council. "This 'don't worry about allied spying, it's okay' 
attitude is
harmful," he warns. "The U.S. should expect that the rest of the 
world is
bent on rooting out its national-security secrets and the 
secrets that
could subject its leaders to blackmail." Minimizing or 
excusing "friendly
spying," he argues, only discourages vigilance and encourages 
more attacks
on U.S. national security. "I'm not outraged by nations that 
find it in
their interests to collect intelligence but by our unwillingness 
to
seriously pursue counterintelligence."

Major, now dean of the private Center for Counterintelligence 
and Security
Studies, asks: "What price should Israel pay for this? My 
predictions are
that there will be no impact whatsoever. Do we put our heads in 
the sand or
do we take it as a wake-up call?"

Others observe that Israel has passed stolen U.S. secrets to 
America's
adversaries. The government of Yitzhak Shamir reportedly 
provided the
Soviet Union with valuable U.S. documents stolen by Israeli spy 
Jonathan
Pollard. "It's the security equivalent of herpes," says a former 
U.S.
antiterrorism official now at a pro-Israel think tank who 
requested
anonymity. "Who gets it [beyond Israel] nobody knows.... Once we 
let it
happen, the word gets out that 'you can get away with this.'"

- JMW

From: Walter
To: Front Lines
Date: Sat Dec 29 14:20:30 2001

Message:
Hey,that was really self-indulgent!Some people read those 
long,drawn-out posts,but many do not,so if you were trying to 
pass information about something you feel is important along,you 
basically failed.

From: an Italian guy
To: Merlyn
Date: Sat Dec 29 14:58:35 2001

Message:
Oh, you were born 1958, I was too...

  "But all this aside, if they keep pushing it...they will be 
getting IT!"
I think, basically people can't say that U.S. military 
interventions of last years are so illegitimate or can justify 
such an hatred from Islam side.

From: om/cf
To: goy Front Lines
Subject: old news
Date: Sat Dec 29 15:58:25 2001

Message:
What a waste of time! Hell, the Jews have attacked New York 
since then and if you look hard enough, they have taken over all 
of America and brainwashed us all into believing it was that Boy 
Scout troop Osama runs or did run.
 Go to GOOGLE and type in something along the lines of Jewish 
Conspiracies and come back with some up to date info.

From: om/cf
To:
Subject: Play by the rules
Date: Sat Dec 29 23:17:49 2001

Message:
Extract from "Basic rules of the Geneva Conventions and their 
Additional Protocols" 

Chapter III: Rules relating to the conduct of combatants and the 
protection of prisoners of war

b) Escapes or attempts to escape

The Convention has several provisions relating to escapes or 
attempts to escape. These are accepted as being consistent with 
military honour and patriotic courage. Punishments incurred in 
cases of escape are consequently limited. Weapons may be used 
against prisoners who escape or attempt to escape, but such use 
should only be made as a last resort and must always be preceded 
by warnings appropriate to the circumstances.[III, 91, 92, 93; 
III, 42]
=================================================================

 Run Johnny, run, Bush is from Texas where they execute criminals
like you. BOOM! Appropriate warning me thinks.

From: Get a grip
To: Osama has bin laden
Subject: Idiot!
Date: Sun Dec 30 13:53:24 2001

Message:
Guess what we will do to stop Osma from attacking the "economy" 
THink 
now..............................................................
.................................................................
.....................Spend 
money!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Osama has been, what an idiot!

From: om/cf
To:
Subject: True Sportsmen
Date: Sun Dec 30 14:03:34 2001

Message:
Afghans revive brutal buzkashi in wake of rigid Taliban regime 
By JOHN OTIS 
Copyright 2001 Houston Chronicle 

KABUL, Afghanistan -- One guidebook calls it "no-rules rugby on 
horseback." War-weary Afghans describe it as more lethal than a 
U.S. bombing run. 
 Either way, the first game of buzkashi, or "goat-dragging," to 
be played in Kabul since the fall of the anti-sports Taliban 
government lived up to its brutal reputation Friday.
  Out-of-control horses, egged on by whip-cracking riders, 
careened into a crowd of several thousand spectators, knocking 
over a dozen or so people. A few sustained minor injuries.
 Buzkashi originated centuries ago in the plains of central 
Asia. It is now played with a beheaded calf, which, some Afghans 
say, is more durable than a goat carcass. 
 Each team consists of 10 to 20 horsemen. The idea is to grab 
the dead animal out of the starter circle, gallop 100 yards or 
so down the field and around a flag, then carry the carcass back 
and drop it into the scoring circle. Players go nonstop for one 
or two hours, or until riders and horses run out of steam. 
=================================================================
NOTE TO AFGHANS:
 al-Queda Arabs are more durable than calfs or goats.
NOTE TO CIA:
 Very effective interrogation technique. When in Rome............


From:
To:
Date: Sun Dec 30 15:05:27 2001

Message:
fuck him what a ass

From: you know who
To: the satan worshipping freemasons
Subject: We will kill u lot in afghanistan and ur GOVERNMENT will cry out of fear
Date: Sun Dec 30 17:41:23 2001

Message:
800 of ur american soldiers are already dead, this is just the 
start .  

all ur allies are suffering also wait for the proper war , this 
is just the beginning

From:
To:
Date: Sun Dec 30 18:09:07 2001

Message:
fuck him what a ass

From: A nice story I found...
To: Those who support the destruction of the USA
Subject: It seems that Binny-Lamma almost got control of U.S.A. Armed forces from within!!!
Date: Sun Dec 30 20:24:18 2001

Message:
I was just wondering, what plan does the USA have
if it's own military 
is under the control
of Islamists?




What does a 'free society' do with groups of Islamists,
or Zionists, or any race, cult, religion, or other group,
whatever the hell they call themselves,
when those groups openly seek to destroy America?

At what point does 'discrimination' intersect with common sense?

Do you really feel safe with a Airport security employee who is
named Mohammed? A bearded guy with a rag on his head?

Or would it give you pause?  
Just for a moment?



What should the USA do, when the Army finds soldiers 
who's first loyalty, is not to the USA Flag,
but to Mohammed?





The Interesting Story:



-----
November 20, 2001 What multiculturalism hath wrought

Do you know that there are 15,000 Muslims serving in the U.S. 
armed forces? 

Are you aware that the U.S. military has Muslim 
Imams?

Following Sept. 11, Capt. Abd Al-Rasheed Muhammad, Imam of 
Walter Reed Army Medical Center in Washington, D.C., asked the 
North American Islamic Jurisprudence Council if it is 
permissible for Muslim troops in the U.S. military to fight 
other Muslims in the war against terrorism.


The council referred the matter to Muslim clerics abroad, who 
issued a Fatwa permitting U.S. Muslims to fight if there was "no 
alternative."


Whew! The chain of command of the U.S. military remained intact. 


But not for long. 

The Middle East Media Research Institute 
(www.memri.org) reports that the Arab clerics reconsidered and 
withdrew permission on Oct. 30, issuing a new Fatwa prohibiting 
U.S. Muslim troops from participating in U.S. attacks on Muslim 
forces.


Can you see where multiculturalism has brought us? 

The chain of command in the U.S. Army has Arab clerics at its 
head.

The idea of a multicultural state is an obvious insanity. The 
problems of multicultural politics led to the breakup of the 
Austrian-Hungarian Empire. 
In our own time, we have witnessed the breakup of the 
multicultural Yugoslav state and Russian Empire.
-----








SO:


What steps should the USA take to protect the government,
the military, financial systems, airports, etc..
from Known Zionists, Islamists, non-USA workers,
illegal workers, communists, etc, etc?

Should those people be: 
Questioned?
Fired?
Imprisoned?
Deported?
or, if found connected to Osama, be put to Death?

Should USA Citizens boycott known business,
who support Arab, Islamist, Zionist, or other foriegn powers?



WHAT SHOULD YOU DO
TO SUPPORT THE U.S.A. ?



From: North carolina Gal
To: I nice strory I found
Date: Sun Dec 30 22:35:41 2001

Message:
In my opinion, if the above post is correct, then Capt. Abd Al. 
Rasheed  Muhammad  needs to  resign his commission... And as far 
as the 15,000  muslims  serving  in the U.S.  armed   forces... 
If they aren't willing to fight then  they should  be 
dishonorably discharged or court martialed!!!!!!

From: om/cf
To: ? and All
Subject: Questions Asked
Date: Sun Dec 30 21:36:47 2001

Message:
Laws and punishments are already in place covering all of your 
fears. Its not like the U.S. became multi-cultural last 
September. America has been multi-cultural since its conception
unlike the historically changing borders of the other areas you
mention. Americas ethnic makeup is unique in the world. There 
will always be indivduals who will blame their failure on others
to reassure their ego.
 Support your country by supporting our troops, whatever their
heritage. Support the U.S.A. by not giving in to your fear, live
your life as you wish. Support the U.S.A by letting our enemies
know that with our Heinz 57 variety society, we are like crazed
fucking dogs foaming at the mouth when pissed off!!
 With New Years Eve approaching, all please remember the planned
attack of year 2000 in Seattle that was foiled. The terrorists
seem to like to have a second go at things as witnessed at WTC
this year. One individual female Border Guard prevented a attack
in 2000 and her questions made a big, bad terrorist run for his
life, leaving his car with a trunkload of explosive materials.
 Happy New Year to all on this board and may the new year bring
the price of Heineken down to a reasonable level here in the 
States!
 

From: North Carolina Gal
To: om/cf
Date: Sun Dec 30 22:55:09 2001

Message:
I agree with you....but if we have people in our armed froces 
that are not willing to fight then we need to get rid of 
them....I know what you mean about heinenken.  Happy New Year to 
You too........

From: om/cf
To: North Carolina Gal & U.K. Citizen
Date: Sun Dec 30 23:05:25 2001

Message:
Im sure the Armed Forces does not allow such behavior. Military
law is much different than civilian law. You have to be able to
trust the man to your right. Teamwork is drilled in their heads
from day one....bad apples get shuffled out one way or another.
You know more than me for sure but I trust their are competant
commanders running the show.
 U.K. Citizen, it looks like Pakistan is the first to blink in
the staredown with India. I must say I fully support India in
their stance against Pakistan. The timing is bad reguarding the
current actions in Afghanistan but they have as much right to
defend their country as anyone. A attack like that on India needs
to be punished and if circumstances where different, they would
be recieving more vocal support than they are. I feel sorry 
somewhat for Tony Blair, he cant even take a short vaccation 
before being called back into action!

 

From:
To: ALL MUSLIM"S
Subject: TRUE
Date: Mon Dec 31 00:55:04 2001

Message:
I am from the U.S.A and a friend of mine found this site, and 
was just woundering if you guys are really muslim or from 
Afgan..otherwise it's coo to be dissing on bin laden or what 
ever his name is...but he should not be killed he should live to 
die in a cell with no windows no light's no sound....nothing!!! 
but to punish his helpers to death so he will have nothing left.

Just what I think we should do many other ways he can be 
punished with.

From: Get a grip
To: All
Subject: Osama Has Been=looser
Date: Mon Dec 31 08:12:08 2001

Message:
The World has a gut full of reason to be very tired of religious 
extremism. The Alqueda have been painfully exposed as JUST THAT! 
Osama Has Been, made sure to make a complete IDIOT of himself by 
releasing that last tape! It proves that the tape of him and his 
buddies gloating about their perverted little scam was REAL! 
Since then most of the pissy antagonistic European propaganda 
has been exposed as PURE SHIT! Thanks to Osama and his vile 
desire to be seen in the media as a sick twisted religious 
FREAK, we no longer have to take any of the speculation or 
pathetic insinuations from anyone! As I had predicted, Saddam 
and his religious totalitarian Alqueda just can't sit still. He 
is using Osama as a front and a face in the media, because he is 
too chicken shit to do it himself!
   Osama Has Been is a LOOSER, utter failure! He has exposed his 
agenda for the entire world to see. NO ONE can justify what he 
has done. Nothing excuses his actions or self-serving motives. 
He runs and hides like a yellow chicken shit and spits vile and 
twisted crap! The complete and totalitarian direction of their 
Israeli jihad is total BULL SHIT!
          Nuff said.........
             

From: FUCK
To: The rest of the fuckers
Subject: You are all fucked
Date: Mon Dec 31 08:40:44 2001

Message:
We're here overseas, and watching all of your sorry mulsim-lover 
asses.  We got plenty of body bags to triple match those used in 
NY, DC, and PA, Osama will die, and if he's not dead yet..he 
will be killed...bottom line.  We take no prisioners..that's 
only in the movies!


From: om/cf
To: all
Subject: Evidence Detruction for next Jiha ha ha ha ha ha
Date: Mon Dec 31 09:39:37 2001

Message:
http://www.msnbc.com/news/679996.asp?pne=msn

Computer in Kabul holds chilling memos 
 
PC apparently used by al-Qaida leaders reveals details of four 
years of terrorism 
 
By Alan Cullison and Andrew Higgins
THE WALL STREET JOURNAL 

From: chad
To: all
Subject: hi
Date: Mon Dec 31 09:54:57 2001

Message:
HI!EVERYBODY

From: CHAD
To: gfvyddsygvgys
Subject: siugh3ui;qgvws
Date: Mon Dec 31 09:59:42 2001

Message:
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5R66R67W356R5WR6346R5W73R5372R53799R7953W6R7R792R6T9E789F 
GUYFVYGU  SO 99pt4t wet7f dl;lguyoy7 r4typ;p;7g48 T7OPLTF4 Y7YDX 
Y7OG Q4H5 Y89GY8V F9 463NY9RTU0QWY

From: Fact Finders
To: To all
Subject: Happy New Year
Date: Mon Dec 31 09:55:40 2001

Message:
Happy New Year 2002 to all, Have a great year ahead and may God 
bring peace to the whole world, starting with ourselves, family 
and friends. Peace be with you all

From:
To:
Subject: To all bin landin supporters
Date: Sun Sep 30 17:26:34 2001

Message:
I hope all bin ladin supporters burn in hell,
Drop a bomb over them and i mean a real a-bomb.


From: om/cf
To:
Subject: New years resolutions
Date: Mon Dec 31 15:52:35 2001

Message:
My hope for the new year is that India nukes fucking Pakistan 
and kills a major portion of their worthless population. There 
never would have been a Taliban movement in Afghanistan without 
the sickness taught to schoolchildren in Pakistan. And the same 
fucking, hate the West and America, is being taught right now. 
No country cheered harder on 9/11/01. They are not our ally by 
any means. They are the reason Osama can countinue to evade 
capture and why many al-Queda and Taliban leaders seem to have 
disappeared. They are aided by the Pakistani people and the 
Pakistani ISI. Pakistan has not helped the effort to defeat and 
kill al-Queda. On the contrary, they have aided our enemies
and the U.S. basically paid them to do so out of neccessity.
 Pakastani terrorists attack and try to wipe out the Indian 
Goverment then at first deny any Pakistani terror groups exist 
or were involved. When India turns up the heat a few weeks 
later, they go round up a few terrorist types to try and appease 
India. Sound familiar? The same shit Arafat has pulled for 
years. Jail a few, then when the heat is off let them go. 
 Pakistan breeds terrorist Muslim America haters and I hope 
India does what they have every right to do. America needs long 
term allies like India more than it needs a country where the 
children are taught to hate the west from the day they start 
school. Dumber than fuck but can burn the American flag real 
good.  Funny how the Pakistanis arent protesting in the streets 
when India has its missles pointed at them. Typical Muslim all 
mouth pussys who dont have the fucking brains to realize what is 
needed to engage in sucsessful warfare in the modern world. It 
will be fun watching Pakistan sing and dance their way out of 
this one. But Im sure they were counting on the fact America and 
Britian still needed them.
 Let India nuke Pakistan and the U.S. will go nuke fucking 
Bahgdad. Saddam says his people are hurting so badly from U.N. 
sactions, lets do him a favor and put him and his people out of 
their misery once and for all. Fuck the other Muslim countries 
and what they think.

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Open Mind/Closed Fist
Subject: Out of the frying pan...
Date: Mon Dec 31 17:10:24 2001

Message:
From what I've read, militant Islamists from Pakistan were 
indeed responsible for the strike on the Indian Parliament. 
India gave Pakistan a list of what it said were known 
terrorists, and details locating training camps of Islamic 
militants....sounds all too familiar. Since Sept 11, I recall 
India giving the U.S.A. very obvious and vocal support, and it's 
probably had it's nose put out of joint since Pakistan's last- 
gasp political decision to aid the U.S. in hunting down those 
responsible. I'd agree in sympathising with India on this one. 
However, I'm just wondering that since these two countries have 
had such animosity towards each other since 1947 (each citing 
their own legal claims to the territory in dispute, in that 
year) whether there were any incursions from the Indian side 
since Sept 11 which may have lead to the attack on their 
Parliament. Just speculating. I think India felt hurt by, in 
it's view, the U.S. adminstration's favouratism of Pakistan. I 
think there's been a misunderstanding and India feels a little 
left out as a result. From what I recall hearing from senior 
U.S. officials that obviously was not their intention. The 
word 'terrorist' seems to be being used rather liberally in 
order hopefully to get the attention of the U.S. to fight 
on "their side". That's not only true with this dispute, but as 
you've read other Brits also cite Irish Rupublican terrorists as 
being a worthy target for U.S. intervention. This might be true 
for other countries too. I think a level of expectation has been 
raised which may go beyond what is practicaly feasible. That 
leads on to my question...

The subject matter on this board, in the main, has stuck to the 
definition and elimination of internationaly organsized 
terrorists, ie; Al-Qeada.

As a result of Sept 11, as an U.S. citizen how do you define 
terrorists and terrorism, that is for want of a better 
word, "worthy" of the U.S's full attention? Speaking personaly 
in regards to the Real I.R.A. cutting off their sources of 
funding would be quite sufficient. Intervention beyond that, in 
whatever form doesn't on the face of it seem viable. I would 
doubt, and would fully understand the reluctance of the average 
U.S. citizen to get their troops involved in our problems. Fair 
point?

On a personal note, I no longer live opposite said sugar 
refinery, I didn't feel it was dangerous enough to live there, 
so I now have a great view of London's budding mini-
Manhattan,......Canary Wharf. I say not dangerous enough, 
because as you may recall the I.R.A. tried to bring down a sixty-
storey building there a few years back by planting a large bomb 
at the base of it. Unpleasant Deja vu. On Sept 12, our 
newspapers had pictures of Canary Wharf as being the next 
target. Not for me the underground bunker, the 800 gallon water 
tank and six months supply of food and provisions, I kind of 
prefer this view.

You sir, and your family...have a great New Year's Day! I'll 
keep in touch.     

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Fact Finders
Subject: Overdue questions.
Date: Mon Dec 31 18:30:24 2001

Message:
Would it be your understanding that Islamic extremism would not 
in the long-term take hold in Indonesia, despite it's vast 
number of poor and unemployed? Is the general population's 
outlook on life different than those in countries where 
religious extremism has gained greater popularity?

Thanks for your wishes of a Happy New Year...let's hope! Those 
same wishes go to you and yours Fact Finders. 

From: U.K.Citizen
To: All those I mentioned at Christmas.
Subject: "Enjoy a good News Years Eve and a peacful New Years Day, 2002!"
Date: Mon Dec 31 18:45:10 2001

Message:

From: Everyman
To: U.K. Citizen, Radio Europe, Italian Guy, (and yes, even U.K. Voices)
Subject: Happy New Year!
Date: Mon Dec 31 19:39:06 2001

Message:
Struck midnight already over there, eh?  Don't spend all those 
Euro Dollars in one place...
Here's to a Happy & Peaceful New Year!

From: om/cf
To: U.K. Citizen
Subject: Terrorism
Date: Mon Dec 31 18:46:55 2001

Message:
Terrorism has many definitions I suppose. The word is almost a 
catch phrase type of thing in the U.S. Obviously some acts are
easy to define as terrorism, such as hijacking airplanes and
murdering as many people as possible with them. I think the key
is in intentional killing as a way of drawing attention to a 
cause. We live in a world that is smaller and more civalized and
educated than its ever been. Terrorists prefer to use a violent
means to make their point, and prefer to live in the world of the
past.
 We hear the Americans and British are terrorists in Afghanistan.
What a crock of shit! If we were intentionally killing Afghans in
their innocent little villages we would have done a hell of a 
better job of it. 
 Little Timmy McVeigh was an American homegrown terrorist. He was
appropriatly put to death this year. To me terrorists try to 
shove their views on people because either they are too stupid to
do it in a peacefull way or their views are so out of touch with
reality that no one will listen to them. And boy does that piss
them off!
 It does irritate me as far as what happened to India. It seems
India stayed very low key with what was going on in Pakistan and
Afghanistan when certainly they could have used the situation to
their advantage. It just strikes me that Pakistan may have used
the situation to their advantage, and that alone tells me volumes
about which country wins my respect. Well, that and watching the
news reports about what is being taught in Pakistans schools.
They spend more time learning anti-American chants than anything.
 I guess I shouldnt wish death on half the population though. 
Someone has to manage the Quikee Marts of America! Its a 
dangerous job but somebody has to do it!
 Happy New Year to you and yours. I was going to say it has to be
better than the previous year but just when you think things cant
get any worse............they usually do.

From: North Carolina Gal
To: Everyone
Subject: Happy New Year
Date: Mon Dec 31 20:11:08 2001

Message:
Want to wish everyone a Happy New Year and many more to come....

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Everyman & Om/Cf, and Spy
Date: Mon Dec 31 20:09:57 2001

Message:
Everyman,Om/cf: Once again, wishing you both a happy New Years 
Eve/Day..at least! We've got fireworks going off everywhere 
here. Never used to be like this, just like we now have 
Halloween and trick or treatin'...American imports?...All the 
best guys!!

Spy: Thanks for the effort re:the Grinch...Most 
entertaining!....and how did you know I got the movie on DVD for 
Christmas?:-) Have a good one sir!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: North Carolina Gal
Date: Mon Dec 31 20:25:44 2001

Message:
....and wishing you and yours a Happy New Year too!!!

From: Fact Finders
To: Om/Cf aU,K Citizen
Date: Mon Dec 31 21:25:11 2001

Message:
First, Om, your comment on Pakistan. I agree with you but not to 
nuke them. America should be careful of this country. As you 
mention the hatred for American are taught there. Why are they 
helping the American then? because they have not choice. Agree 
or disagree America is still going to use their Air Space and 
also they would get some financial aid from America. So Mr 
Musharaf is smart not like those idiots that protest in the 
streets. I believe Mr Musharaf is a good Man.

About the similarity with Arafat, yes again that what all these 
muslim goverment who support these terrorist are doing. First if 
they don't support them, they are afraid that these terrorist 
will call them American Puppet and turn against them. Secondly 
they would be blame for not hiding so call Islamic matyrs. So 
they put them away in prison (or safe house) to prevent them 
from being prosecuted in the countries they terrorize and as you 
say realease them (maybe they are allow to go home or their 
family can stay with them in the safe house) after the heat die 
down.

As for UK Citizen. There no so much muslim extremist in 
Indonesia, more of "power graber" The people are poor, if they 
are paid to do things by these power graber to distabalize the 
country they would be glad to do it a probably can loot shop and 
houses after they destroy it. The situation  has improved. After 
4 years of unrest they seem to tired down because, many realize 
that they become even poorer without foreigner visiting them. So 
with the New Goverment, they are trying to encourage investment 
and tourism back to Indonesia.


From: Fact Finders
To: To All
Subject: The fat lady
Date: Mon Dec 31 22:15:00 2001

Message:
I really wonder what happen to the fat lady that was doing her 
stupid tongue thing over world television after the sept 11 
attack in the street of Palestinian. Is she still dancing? Has 
any of her love one been kill since Sept 11?

Fat Lady how I wish you would be on this board. How many people 
have lost their loveone and yet you dance in the street. How 
many people in that building love your country. You don't know 
and yet they have to die without knowing why.

At least you know why the Isreal is attacking your leaders 
because your people are attacking them in a cowardly ways.

Wake up, fat lady and go do something more for the thin lady in 
Afghanistan and not hope that those people that you so happily 
dance when your so call brothers kill their children and friends 
to help.

I am refering to all who felt the same as that fat, tongue job 
idiot. Not only to her.

Any fat ladies (sorry, not refering to the phisically fat 
ladies) who wanted to pose and comment on behalf of that 
particular lady can do so. I would be waiting.

From: om/cf
To: Fact Finders& Merlyn
Date: Mon Dec 31 22:20:54 2001

Message:
Fact Finders I really dont want to see nuclear weapons ever 
used. Thankfully I cannot get near any red buttons with my hot
temper! I agree with you on Pres. Musharaf, I saw a couple 
interviews with him when he was in the U.S. and he seemed genuine
and honourable. He does have a problem with the extremists which
requires him to walk a tightwire, he is always one comment away
from pissing them off. But if he needs some help, now would be
the time to ask.
 Merlyn, any predictions for the new year? You had a inkling of
an attack of some sort after Ramadon and before Christmas as did
I. Pray for peace but prepare for war.

From: om/cf
To: Fact Finders
Subject: Fat Lady
Date: Mon Dec 31 22:54:22 2001

Message:
Thanks for the fat lady story! I laughed my ass off. We have a 
saying in the U.S. Its not over untill the fat lady gets her
tongue cut out. (Slightly modified version)

From: Spy
To: "the Good Guys" {you know who you are---(I think)--}
Subject: Happy New Year !!!
Date: Mon Dec 31 23:37:16 2001

Message:

From: om/cf
To: Spy
Subject: The New Year
Date: Mon Dec 31 23:52:34 2001

Message:
May the new year bring the fire from hell to Osama and his buds
while they are still on earth! He still apparently has one 
working arm. One appendage at a time I guess.
 Take care.

From: om/cf
To: ALL AMERICANS
Subject: Happy New Year
Date: Tue Jan 1 01:27:59 2002

Message:
Lets continue on but not ever forget what happened this year or
the lives of each person lost in New York, Washington or 
Pennsylvania on that surreal day in September. I have a deep
feeling for those who lost loved ones in the WTC and dont even
have a body to bury. Its beyond sad. I will never forget or 
forgive.

From: Everyman
To: All
Subject: New Year
Date: Tue Jan 1 04:10:37 2002

Message:
***********************************
  HAPPY NEW YEAR!
***********************************

From: an Italian guy
To: all righteous people in the world
Date: Tue Jan 1 07:07:03 2002

Message:
To all them I wish a GREAT NEW YEAR.

(Still waiting for the "great piece of news").

From: Merlyn
To:
Subject: prediction
Date: Tue Jan 1 11:36:40 2002

Message:
Hell of a year, literally.
 During the time of the black cloud, the following happened.
Terrorists continued the plague of hate, attacking the 
parliament in India on Sunday, Setting fires in Australia and 
the "walking death that would fail" also came true in the form 
of explosive in the shoes of the terrorist that was caught 
trying to light them while in flight. The anthrax residue in the 
mail machines is no mystery; simply sending letters through them 
causes cross contamination that has caused death of old people 
too weak to fight it off. Many many people have become sick from 
it & just taken antibiotics or have been able to become immune 
to it. 
  All of this is the black cloud I had foreseen, problems here 
and all over the world. Now I see light. In many ways I and 
others have worked on this. Despite the remaining problems and 
inevitable battles yet to be finished, the real problem has been 
brought to light. In the very end of the "dark cloud" came the 
end of doubt. The bringing of light to the issue was highlighted 
by Usama Bin Laden himself. In his self-serving and arrogant way 
he insisted on being in the media spotlight. This both dammed 
him and his self-serving agenda and that of all that perpetuate 
this Muslim totalitarian agenda. Not all Muslims want it, in 
fact very few. By admitting and gloating, Usama basically cut 
his own throat. There can be no more doubt that Usama used and 
took advantage of religious extremism. He subjugated and 
persecuted his own people, just like Saddam Hussein, and 
therefore alienated himself from them. By destroying the 
Buddhist presence in Afghanistan he displayed to all the world 
that he is the very worst example of ETHNIC CLEANSING, the very 
thing he claims he is victim of. 
  With this final act, the world now sees clearly for the first 
time in history on a global scale never before possible, Usama 
has by his own actions destroyed himself and his sick little 
Jihad. From here on out there will be an ALL OUT, EVERY PERSON, 
EVERY DAY, EVERY MINUTE and EVERY WAY POSSIBLE, effort to wipe 
the earth clean of him and all those like him. Thus...Light!
  Despite all things, it can only get better; it's been going on 
for well over a THOUSAND YEARS!
              With peace from the stone circle 
                       Merlyn /|\

From: SARAH(BRITAIN)
To: GEORGE BUSH
Subject: KILL OSMA BIN LADEN
Date: Tue Jan 1 14:03:08 2002

Message:
I HOPE YOU KILL BIN LADEN BECAUSE HE IS VERY EVIL.
I FELT SORRY FOR THE PAIN THAT THE PEOPLE WENT THROUGH ON THE 
SEPT 11TH.
IF I HAD ONE WISH IT WOULD BE THAT THERE IS NO MORE 
WARS,TERROIST ATTACKS,EVIL THINGS AND THE WORLD CAN LIVE IN 
PEACE.
ALL THE BEST FOR THIS YEAR 
SARAH

From:
To:
Subject: Fat Lady
Date: Tue Jan 1 21:41:01 2002

Message:
The fat lady probably learn her tonque job from monica lewinsky 
and had done it on Arafat, Osama and who knows Sadam, that was 
why she is so good at it, and perform live in front of 
International Network. Probably she get anthrax in liquid form 
from Sadam and is "dying" for more

From: Master Israel
To: Slave USA
Subject: stop your crying...
Date: Tue Jan 1 23:06:31 2002

Message:
Shut up USA... sit down and be quite.

Keep paying your master...

Israel is watching you and your government...

so don't step out of line!

And don't listen to those people trying to undermine ZOG:

http://zog.to/2/zog/IsraelSpies8a.htm

It's silly to think Israel would hurt it's golden calf!

So don't read this site, and Listen only to what CNN tells you
to believe.  

Listen to Israel, don't listen to them:
http://zog.to/2/zog/zog-ind.htm

Israel will tell you what to believe, 
so don't try thinking for yourselves...













From: The national socalists of American Workers
To: ALL OTHER RACIES OTHER THAN THOSE OF GERMAN HERITAGE
Date: Fri Sep 14 17:19:53 2001

Message:
IT IS MY PLACE TO CONDEM ALL OF YOU. FOR YOU ALL MANIPULATE THE 
SYSTEMS THAT GOVERN YOU. THE FACT REMAINS THAT NONE OF YOU WERE 
QUICK TO HELP YOUR FELLOW CITAZEN UNTEL THIS TRADAGIE TOOK 
PLACE. IF YOU HAD CARED MORE TO BEGIN WITH THIS MIGHT NOT OF 
HAPPENED AT ALL, BUT WITH DEFEAT YOU CAN OVER COME WITH 
DAVERSITY. LET THIS BE A LESSON THAT IT BETTER TO HAVE CARED 
FROMM THE BEGGINING, INSTEAD OF STEPPING IN AT A TIME OF NEED 
FOR A COUNTRY. GIVEN THAT MY CLASS OF PEOPLE HAVE BEEN GIVEN A 
BAD NAME IN THE PAST JUST REMEMBER IF WE HAD WON THE WAR THIS 
BROWN BEN LADEN WOULD HAVE BEEN TERMANATED ANY WAY.

From: The national socalists of American Workers
To: ALL OTHER RACIES OTHER THAN THOSE OF GERMAN HERITAGE
Date: Fri Sep 14 17:19:53 2001

Message:
IT IS MY PLACE TO CONDEM ALL OF YOU. FOR YOU ALL MANIPULATE THE 
SYSTEMS THAT GOVERN YOU. THE FACT REMAINS THAT NONE OF YOU WERE 
QUICK TO HELP YOUR FELLOW CITAZEN UNTEL THIS TRADAGIE TOOK 
PLACE. IF YOU HAD CARED MORE TO BEGIN WITH THIS MIGHT NOT OF 
HAPPENED AT ALL, BUT WITH DEFEAT YOU CAN OVER COME WITH 
DAVERSITY. LET THIS BE A LESSON THAT IT BETTER TO HAVE CARED 
FROMM THE BEGGINING, INSTEAD OF STEPPING IN AT A TIME OF NEED 
FOR A COUNTRY. GIVEN THAT MY CLASS OF PEOPLE HAVE BEEN GIVEN A 
BAD NAME IN THE PAST JUST REMEMBER IF WE HAD WON THE WAR THIS 
BROWN BEN LADEN WOULD HAVE BEEN TERMANATED ANY WAY.

From: om/cf
To: nsaw
Subject: Master race.......
Date: Wed Jan 2 06:58:46 2002

Message:
my ass! If Hitler saw your spelling he would have had you put
to death as well. See, Im also of German heritage and we are
very nitpicky.
 If we had won the war............wake up, its time for your job
interview down at Burger King. Boy, if you only knew how many
Jewish worked in the Clinton administration it would ruin your
whole day. Thank God we now have a President who actually listens
to what his advisors say instead worrying about his afternooner!

From: Son of God
To: German/Israel
Subject: Ass hole comments
Date: Wed Jan 2 07:49:55 2002

Message:
Hey dick weed, go fuck yourself! Pack sand up your ass & shit 
yourself yor pathetic fantisy. As for the German maggot! You 
couldn't do anything with the Fatherland anyway, they have you 
stepping & fetching, step out of line and they will rip your 
head off & shit down your neck! As for the faggot from Israel, 
your sick little pea brain can't figure out the time of day, YOU 
LOST! Fucking LOOSER! or didn't you get the message. Usama is 
ruler of a cave now, not a country! Stupid shit! 

From: Son of god
To: America
Subject: New year
Date: Wed Jan 2 07:58:00 2002

Message:
Walk proud America! your resolve has risen to the task! All the 
world sees that we were right and just in our act of defence! 
The Islamic world has a clear message..DON'T TREAD ON ME! One 
more stupid mistake and the weather in Islam will be about 300 
deg., high winds & very DRY! Pakistan is about to get a wakeup 
call. India is priming the nukes right now! Islam wishes all 
they had to worry about is America. But the fact is that ALL the 
worl is sick of their pissy little whine and back stabbing 
theives! Walk proud! talk Loud! America, THE LAND OF THE FREE!

From: Son of god
To: Master race
Subject: like shit
Date: Wed Jan 2 08:08:15 2002

Message:
Master race my ass, Least you could do is get a life. Your 
comment is about as pathetic a shit of ignorant crap as anyone 
has ever seen. You are a stupid piss ant!

From: Son of God
To: Jew boy
Subject: Yer Yamica is on too tight!
Date: Wed Jan 2 08:19:45 2002

Message:
Your little boy Gore got shut out! right along with all your 
sick little JEWISH SHIT! You LOST! get it?? You don't controll 
jack shit. You can't even controll a 3rd world shit hole like 
Pakistan! You have to buy all your wepons from AMERICA because 
you stupid JEW FAGGOTS couldn't figure out a set of Leggos or 
even work a Betty Crocker recipie! Take your Dradel & sit & spin 
and go fuck yourself! You all think you are Divine...You are 
shuch a pack of self serving shit! 

From: Son of God
To: Jew Boy
Subject: Shitty Zion site
Date: Wed Jan 2 09:06:01 2002

Message:
Your pea brain can't figure that no one cares about your little 
racist Zion site! You Jews have your head shoved so far up your 
ass you can't see the light of day! I hope the Master Race gets 
a life and wipes you and your Jew shit off the face of the 
Earth! I wish the Nazi's had finished the job! Wern't the three 
stooges Jewish?? 

From: Justice
To: All
Subject: translation software
Date: Wed Jan 2 10:20:45 2002

Message:
This is pretty cool.  Nice to read how their views are over 
seas.  Go to www.al-Jazeera.net and translate.


To get an Arab's view of U.S. foreign policy, look no further 
than the Web site of Al-Jazeera, the popular Qatari satellite TV 
station whose site is peppered with photos of slain Afghan and 
Palestinian children. 

But unless you read Arabic, a language that employs its own 
alphabet, there's no way to read the text. 

Until now, that is. 

In October, Cairo-based Sakhr Software released its Arabic-to-
English translation software -- free for the world to use -- on 
the company's Arabic language Web portal at Ajeeb.com. 

The software sits on servers at the portal, where users can 
access it. If you type in the URL of an Arabic language site, 
the translation engine will roughly convert it English. You can 
translate raw text as well. 


From: Justice
To: Master Israel
Date: Wed Jan 2 11:54:31 2002

Message:
You are just another conspiracy theory idiot.  I don't believe 
everything on CNN but I would trust it more than that two bit 
site you put up.  Quit being so paranoid.  You are showing us 
your ignorant views of the world.  Crawl out of your hole and 
view the world for yourself.

From: t|-|e_|)()|\|
To: The One and other like him
Date: Wed Jan 2 13:15:18 2002

Message:
the one if what u say about muslims is true then may god forgive 
us and if what u say about muslims is untrue then may god 
forgive u

From: Muslim hater
To: Muslim Shit
Subject: Fuck Muslims!
Date: Wed Jan 2 14:14:01 2002

Message:
Bunch of Lying sack of shit 
scum!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!EAT SHIT AND 
DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!























































































































Your Hell is Waiting!!!!!!! Allah is the DEVEL Demon!!!!!!!!!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Son of God, Sarah(Britain), Justice, t|-|e_|)()|\|
Date: Wed Jan 2 13:31:04 2002

Message:
Son of God: Regarding Master Israel...I very much doubt that's 
an Israeli, a Jew or a Zionist or any combination of those 
three. Whoever it is probably hates Jewish people. I confess to 
knowing little about Z.O.G., nor do I wish to, except I figure 
that they're just a bunch of extremist nobodies.....just like 
Master Race.

Sarah (Britain): With reference to the sentiments in your post, 
I'm sure we'd all want the same. All the best Sarah.

Justice: Tried Al-Jazeera via Ajeeb.com, with only partial 
success. Did Al-Jazeera translate entirely when you tried it? 
I'll persevere though. Thanks nonetheless.

the Don: Inventive typing sir. Respect. 

From: Justice USA
To: Spy, Eagle Eye, John, et all.
Subject: MISSING IN ACTION
Date: Wed Jan 2 14:51:49 2002

Message:
HAPPY FUCKEN NEW YEAR TO ALL THAT ARE PRO USA.  Now, remember, 
when I told you guys that bin shithead was in Pakistan?  Am I 
psychic or what?  Now, where are Eagle Eye, John, Spy, Radio 
Europe.  Holland/Italy, and other assorted goodies on this 
board?  Dammit to hell, DONT JUMP SHIP.  We are in for a long 
mothher fucken war.  Fuck yeah!  Glad 2001 is the fuck over, 
rober.  I hate four fucken cups of coffee and no one is on this 
mother fucker?  Explain yourselves.  aaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh!!!

From: Everyman
To: Justice USA
Subject: Hang in there
Date: Wed Jan 2 15:36:49 2002

Message:
Hey, Justice USA,
Thought of you when I heard the bells ringing in NY--must have 
been tough to hear them 'in person'.
Yes, you were right on the money--he was probably there when you 
said he was; probably made his last tape there,living very 
comfortably whilst his minions do battle for him.....

From: om/cf
To: Everyman & U.K.Citizen
Subject: Ajeeb
Date: Wed Jan 2 18:07:09 2002

Message:
I tried Ajeeb to translate the other day and it worked o.k. on 
Al-Jazeera, although there were some strange words in some 
strange places, it was funny. But when I tried it on some Iraqi
newspapers off The Paperboy.com I couldnt get it to work. Im 
going to play with it some tonight. Im sure the Arabic papers are
controlled by Sodamn Insane too, that bastard.

From: om/cf
To:
Subject: War? on terrorism
Date: Wed Jan 2 20:32:59 2002

Message:
What the fuck are we doing? Are we in Afghanistan to fight a 
war, to get justice and put fucking fear into these maggots, or
are we there to demonstrate our knowledge of political 
correctness to all the godamn backward ass tribal fucking chiefs
and have a fucking Boyscout campout?
 Our special forces and marines are being used as private 
investigators hunting up scraps of paper and taking fucking soil
samples to test. Im sick of reading the same old shit every day,
the best guess where Osama and the bigshots are today. If we have
total contol over Afghaistan and Pakistan we should have been
tearing every fucking village and hamlet apart to accomplish our
goals, not running around like chickens with their heads cut off
on information from some hillbilly fucking Afghans and Pakistanis
who think running water is a fucking miracle from Allah. Hey, 
guess what? The dumb fuckers lie their asses off.
 Pakistan has screwed us around from day one. They have double 
the bin Laden supporters that Afghanistans got. If we dont get
our shit together militarily and politically reguarding our
focas and purpose over there I think each day puts our troops at
greater risk. America is not there on a peace keeping mission.
We are there to get as many of the motherfuckers that attacked 
our country as we can. Right now we are not doing it due to the
fucking asshole politicos who dont want to hurt any feelings.
Fuck that SHIT!! Apologize later if need be.
 Any civilians who get in the way at this sure as hell should 
know better. Pakistan is hiding a whole shitload of al-Queda and
has been smuggling them out as fast as they can. Not the 
goverment, but the countless supporters of big-Lippin and al-
Queerda. And the more that get away, the greater our chances of
being attacked again and again. If this is a WAR, I want the 
U.S.A to fight it like a WAR, and DO IT RIGHT. I just feel this
thing is getting bogged down in a political fucking mudhole
right now. KICK ASS AND TAKE NAMES! We shouldnt be looking to 
make fucking freinds for life with any of these countries! They
HATE US and always will and FUCK THEIR FEELINGS!

From: om/cf
To: all
Subject: Snipe hunts
Date: Wed Jan 2 21:48:36 2002

Message:
Does anyone know what a Snipe hunt is? You get a bunch of people
out into the woods, give them paper bags, tell them to stand at
the bottom of a heavily wooded hill for a long time in the middle
of a pitch black night. Tell them to hold their bags to the 
ground, it may take awhile, and we'll chase the Snipes down the
hill into your bags. There are many variations of this old trick.
 Now dont make me get into the story of the Square Eyed Wampus 
Cat.

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Open Mind/Closed Fist
Subject: Pest Control
Date: Wed Jan 2 22:27:12 2002

Message:
From what I've read from, and I quote, "the best dang Snipe site 
on the web!" your Snipes are getting of hand in your part of the 
world, a bit like our foxes here. They're pests, but every 
couple of years the 'lefties' try to ban fox hunting, not 
politically correct it seems. Let's hope in another part of the 
world there's a snipe hunt on using some nice body bags with a 
snug fit for a certain individual....hey....now don't make ME 
get into the story of the Round Eyed Mullah Omar!   

From: Fact Finders
To: OM/CF
Date: Wed Jan 2 23:18:11 2002

Message:
As I said before, this war has gone on a wrong agenda. What you 
said is all correct. Where are Osama, Mullah, the young 
spokesman, and all their supporters including those in pakistan 
that burn the US flag beginning of this war. As mention again 
and again will the new Afghan goverment be on US side if US were 
to attack another muslim country habouring terrorist. I would 
like to see what happen.

The main issue is to get those Muslims Idiot to understand Islam

From: om/cf
To: U.K. Citizen
Subject: They run but they sure cant hide
Date: Wed Jan 2 23:01:17 2002

Message:
Ya, that Omar is a real piece of work! Urging the followers to 
fight on to the death, while negotiating the best deal he can get
for himself. What a hero. Binny boy too. He sure as hell is 
fighting martyrdom! Like all great artists, his work would be so
much better if he was dead.
 The second team terrorist was in court again today. He says 
Allah will speak for him. Apparently thats his laywers name. But
on a serious note, I've read there is no shortage of top notch
laywers here in the states willing to take on terrorist cases to
make a name for themselves. I just hope nobody forgets their 
forgets their names! And they wonder, why all the jokes?
 I went to the bank with my paycheck today, and the teller I had
is from Bosnia. I only know because most of the gals are not hard
to look at or converse with. Anywho, she asked me how I would 
like my cash back. I said in Euros. 

From: Walker
To: all
Date: Thu Jan 3 00:33:22 2002

Message:
Notice no new stuff about John Walker?If they can keep him out 
of the news,my guess would be a sentence of 10-15 years.With good 
behaviour,thats only 5-6 years.And with the book and movie 
rights,he'll probably get at least a million.200,000$ a year:Just 
for hating America's guts,and joining the Taliban.
 And to think that only 6 months ago,I thought burning the flag 
was a shit thing to do.

From: Walter
To:
Date: Thu Jan 3 00:41:56 2002

Message:
The idea pissed me off so bad,I typed MY name Walker!LOL!!!

From: Justice
To: Walter, UK Citizen
Date: Thu Jan 3 00:52:25 2002

Message:
That's funny Walter.  I agree with you though.  That fuck Walker 
will probably make some money off of this shit.

UK Citizen, It worked ok for me after I tried it a couple of 
times.  It did not work on the first try.  I guess they have 
bugs to work out.

From: Everyman
To: om/cf, U.K.Citizen
Subject: Snipe Hunt
Date: Thu Jan 3 06:33:40 2002

Message:
Ah, yes!  The proverbial snipe hunt!  How well I remember it-
sixth grade camp in the woods of Northern Michigan.  I was 
skeptical about it then, too...

From: Get a grip
To: Taliban
Subject: Mine clearing
Date: Thu Jan 3 08:32:55 2002

Message:
I think the captured taliban should be given capitalist 
training! Chain their legs together and have them clear mine 
fields by walking across them! If they get their leg blown off, 
they are free to run! Well.. limp away. What do you do with 
hundreds of captured prisoners of war? Put them to work! 
  As for our troops picking through the trash for evidence? We 
have to remember that the real ass holes died in the act of 
terrorism. Too chicken shit to face the music or do the time. 
Omar, Usama and the rest of the girl scouts will be rounded up 
soon. Winter is setting in and they will be starved out or 
fight. Supply lines are easy to find and simple to cut off. 

From: Merlyn
To: Walter, E.S.D. Italian guy
Subject: next move
Date: Thu Jan 3 09:34:51 2002

Message:
Me thinks that persuing the next pile of rag heads into the 
African territory may well ignite real problems for the US. We 
are turning our back to the Pakistan issue deliberatly. We 
really don't need to be babysitters anyway, but will chasing 
girl scouts really solve anything? I don't think droppiing bombs 
is the way to go here. There are much more effective ways. Seems 
this is a "high profile" step. Keeping it all in the media must 
be an important factor but a waste of time. As dirty a war as 
these sick religious maggots started, we should play the game 
more close to the chest so to speak. I am sure there is a great 
deal going on that is out of sight, the death of usama is one of 
those things. I really think usama was dead before the last tape 
was aired. We have no use for him, unlike Saddam. Saddam is just 
a lesser evil than what would replace him.
           Merlyn /|\ 

From: Get a grip
To: Whiners
Date: Thu Jan 3 15:49:36 2002

Message:
As much as the towel heads have been suffering from shrink wrap 
syndrome, Bush has a case of exploded confidence. Worrysome it 
is when he decides to go hunting down the pathetic girl scouts 
in India. There are much more important issues here at home that 
really do need attention. As for keeping towel heads off of 
airplanes, good. I don't really think one or two pissed off girl 
scouts warrent putting America at risk. As for stopping 
immagration, good! We have enough girl scouts here already. We 
need time to get things up and running again. In a word.... 
TOUGH SHIT! When we feel like giving a home to the self serving 
lazy out of work world full of illiterate goof-offs we will. 
Untill then go get a life! Get a job! and do some work for a 
change. It is not my fault the world is full of dead beats! 

From: Walter
To: Merlyn
Date: Thu Jan 3 15:35:14 2002

Message:
I've been hearing a lot of Americans getting upset over some of 
the killing in Afghanistan.Some of these are the same people who 
wanted us to go over there.What did they think happens in a 
war?How could they be so ignorant?Maybe they thought we would fly 
in 1 plane,punch a few people in the stomach,and fly back 
home.Who knows?I'm starting to wonder where these people have 
been mentally for the last few years.
 You might be right on the money about Usama/Osama.His name would 
be a good tool to use whether he were dead or alive to use as a 
terrorist icon.
 

From: Walter
To:
Subject: Read this on CNN
Date: Thu Jan 3 15:58:02 2002

Message:
The first contingent of French troops have joined the 
international peacekeeping mission in Afghanistan.

The group of 15 soldiers arrived on Wednesday at Bagram Air Base, 
the French Embassy in Kabul told CNN.___________________________

15 soldiers.15 Soldiers.The fucking block I live on could have 
sent more than that!Of all the useless fucked-up gestures I've 
ever read about in the last 30 years,this wins the prize.
 Do us all a favour France,stay home. 

From: Justice USA
To: All
Subject: Getting fucked in the ass by CIA
Date: Thu Jan 3 17:40:35 2002

Message:
Isnt it wonderful how our very own government has fucked us in 
the ass?  CIA scumbags.  They created this whole bin laden 
bullshit and they CREATED the deaths of our innocent people on 
September 11th by doing so.  Patriotism is great.  I love 
America.  But I despise most of the government.  I think I can 
understand where Walter is coming from now. The biggest joke is 
that Assama is in Pakistan now, just like I said so all along.  
The propoganda that the media spews is revolting.  Every day a 
different headline talking shit about HEARING laden's voice in 
caves, etc.  We look like bloody fools over there with our heads 
up our asses.  Our wonderful men and women and supporters that 
are putting their lives on the line and being sent on a wild 
goose chase.  WE FED THEM LUNCH and now they are already 
betraying us.  The president of Pakistan had to give into our 
demands at a very crucial time, but even he is helpless to do 
anything now.  I never trusted Pakistan from day one.  I feel 
that laden will NEVER be caught or killed and that he is tightly 
protected.  Did anyone in their right fucking mind REALLY 
BELIEVE that this fucken coward douchebag would be waiting to be 
annihilated in some cave in Afghanistan?  This shit has been 
planned over and over again for years.  Thanks to the fucken 
government of ours that let these fuckers live after they did 
the first attack on the WTC.  Even Bush is turning out to be a 
colossol pussy with his sympathy of Walker calling him 
a "confused Lad"  what about all the previous statements Bush 
made about destroying anyone that supported the taliban?  Why 
not blow this fuckers brains out in living color so all the 
other assholes in the USA that live off our beautiful land and 
hate us with a passion could have a preview of things to come 
and what about that fucken FBI cocksucker that sold our secrets 
a few months ago?  Why is he not given the electric chair?  Our 
fucken US government makes us the laughing stock of the entire 
world.  We look like pussies.  Keep feeding the fuckers in 
Afghanistan while our own families live in abondoned cars here 
in the USA.  Remember people, nobody can fuck you better than 
your own government.  Trust authority goddammit, it is not just 
a sixties slogan but one for 2002 as well.  I am DISGUSTED by 
the mess that our own fucken government has gotten us into.  
Sons of bitches. Stay the fuck out of the middle east and let 
them take care of their own problems.  I am so fucken tired of 
this politically correct joke of a war. I agree with whatwas 
said in the previous post about it.   Who gives a flaming fuck 
about their feelings?  This is fucken war, it was never meant to 
be pretty.  When is the goddamned United States of America 
Governement going to get their head out of their ass?  I am 
tired of TOUGH TALK and Empty promises.  We should round up all 
the fucken illegal aliens and what have you in this country and 
send em back home.  It pains me that my wonderful country is run 
by idiots.  What kind of free society do we live in if, we are 
not allowed to have a TRUE SAY or even have the knowledge about 
what is going on with our own fucken so called leaders?  

From: om/cf
To: Walter & Justice USA
Date: Thu Jan 3 18:16:46 2002

Message:
Walter, easy now on those Frenchies, its an Olympic year and 
most of their soldiers are training for the Figure Skating 
competition! When they say "A few good men" they really mean it!
 Justice, I know what you mean. I stayed patient after 911 in
reguards to attacking al-Queda, knowing we had to get everthing 
in place logistically and diplomatically. But supposedly we've
been in control for some time now and we are getting our intel
from fucking tribal chiefs with ages old axes to grind. Godammit,
if our goverment is going to fire everybody up for WAR, then lets
fucking do it up right! I know I sure get the idea we are getting
led around by the short hairs over there. A month ago we should 
have been operating on our own intel, not some fucking 
sheepherder (wink, wink) poppy farmer.
 Now here in the USA you got all these Arabs just licking their
fucking lips at a chance to make a windfall off of lawsuits 
because their fucking feelings were hurt when they get singled 
out getting on airplanes. And there is no shortage of scumbag
laywers waiting to get their cut. It makes me sick!
 Clintons' dog Buddy got hit by a car and killed. Why the hell
couldnt it have been Billy Bob who put us in the position we are
in now! Why? Why? Why?

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Walter
Subject: Home grown crackpots
Date: Thu Jan 3 21:22:20 2002

Message:
You've got Walker...we've got Reid. I guess everybody assumed on 
his arrest that his passport was a false one, but as it turns 
out it wasn't...ouch! Another impressionable individual 
manipulated and indoctrinated by extremists and a legitimate 
British Citizen to boot...just great. To compound the problem it 
turns out that our intelligence services, namely M.I.5, have 
blundered big-time too in their efforts, therefore claiming 
the 'Dunce's hat'. According to the British Observer broadsheet 
the C.I.A. warned British Intelligence about Richard Reid, but 
to no avail. He could have been prevented from stepping onto 
that flight in the first place!

http://www.observer.co.uk

Subsection: War on terrorism
Specific story: (M.I.5 blunders over bomber. dated 30.12.01)  

From: Get a grip
To: Usama
Date: Thu Jan 3 21:49:36 2002

Message:
Funny how such a shit head could be worth so much money dead. 
Well fuck, another political campeign, so much for war. Seems we 
just cant bomb em like we used to. Sorta bugs me that each bomb 
is worth so much more than what it hits. Led was a lot cheaper. 
Kind of sloppy seconds going in after the USSR. Not much to 
like. Every time we get close to a fight they want to surrender, 
so much for martyrs. I can't get no satisfaction! I want Usama 
in traction, Gotta Bone to Pick with that fucker... Rich ass 
holes can't stay hidden, so I guess he's dead anyway. 

From: So Sorry
To: everyone who worte a message on this page
Date: Sun Sep 30 17:26:34 2001

Message:
I ran into this site while surfing the internet and I read 
through the messages. I was shocked and saddened by how you all 
felt. This page is full of hate. Hate is not the answer. And 
pointing fingers will not get you anywhere. Yes something 
horrible happened and yes it hurts everyone, but hate is not the 
answer. We have to get up off our feet and live again. Holding 
grudges will get you no where. We all want vengence, but the 
Northern alliance is working on that, we do not need to sit in 
front of our computers and write about hate. One of the worst 
things I read said something to the affect of kill the Muslims, 
that is horrible to write, people did this, not an entire 
religion, it was hate that lead to the events of September 11 in 
the first place. If we begin to hate an entire race whats to say 
we will not commit a crime like this one in the future. Is that 
fair that we can kill inocent victims as they did. Please, learn 
to love. We cant allow ourselves to grow with hate, we dont know 
what it will do to us in the future. And remember "an eye for an 
eye leaves the world blind"

From: U.K.Citizen
To: So sorry
Subject: Snap judgements
Date: Thu Jan 3 22:18:11 2002

Message:
If you look closely, there are a number of differing viewpoints 
on this board. Should you wish to make sweeping statements 
please read the archives of this board before making them. I 
sincerely hope you put your high ideals into pratice as well as 
simply preaching them. 

From: om/cf
To: So Sorry
Subject: Sunday Sept. 30
Date: Thu Jan 3 22:44:37 2002

Message:
You must have read posts from right after the attacks on New 
York and Washington or maybe we are stuck in the TWIGHLIGHT ZONE!
All are so much calmer now and we see things crystal clearly now.
I know this is not very Ghandilike, but many are still pissed off
and believe if the punishment is severe enough it will act as a 
deterant.
 What is your enlightened solution to terrorism? Give fucking 
Osama and his thugs a big hug and tell them how much we love 
them? Invite them to the White House for tea and a fucking group
hug? We also dont need to sit in front of computers spouting 
pacifist bullshit when the only thing the terrorist motherfuckers
understand is bombs, guns and death. Maybe we should be talking 
about better treatment of the current Taliban and al-Queda 
prisoners, oh, lets not forget that poor lost laddy John Walker.
================================================================

U.K.Citizen: I dont normally watch Jay Leno but last night he had
a hilarious "interview" with Reid in the orange jumpsuit. "Reid"
was talking about putting a bomb up in his bum, but it would be
even harder to light the fuse. I laughed my bum off! I had too 
much time off work over the holidays and got used to staying up 
later. Off to bed with me.

From: Boskodude
To: Osama bin Ladin
Subject: The Fagot Band of Bin Ladin Terrorists...
Date: Thu Jan 3 23:37:42 2002

Message:
What kind of a "Man" would purposely send his own militia to 
kill not only themselves but innocent men, women and children 
who were in the World Trade Center???  Why couldn't bin ladin 
have taken on our nation's military instead? What was his point 
in destroying people's lives who had nothing to do with any 
harm towards him personally? President Bush's own views and 
words that this was indeed an act of Cowardice hit the nail 
right on the head. Now after America has had the grave 
misfortune of meeting Osama bin Ladin, it seems rather accurate 
to say Bin Ladin IS...A Piece of Shit...! A man with NO 
concience a man with no remorse a man with no soul...and one 
day a man with no Cave left to hide like the whimp little pussy 
that he has proven himself to be. 

From: Amazed
To: All you idiots
Subject: Macho posturing
Date: Thu Jan 3 23:48:11 2002

Message:
I'm not sure quite why I'm bothering with this, because 
you're mostly too stupid to understand.  But, well, some 
things need saying.

btw, Allah ain't the devil: `Allah' is Arabic for `god'.  I don't 
suppose I should be surprised at this level of ignorance 
amongst Yanks, though, should I?

Now that's out of the way: all these rantings, ravings, and 
wailings are quite funny.  Don't any of you morons realise 
that the reason the WTC was destroyed was US foreign 
policy?  Do you not know that the Tora Bora `cave' complex 
is in fact a full on underground military base built with CIA 
money?  That the Taliban ran Afghanistan because of US 
involvement in the country?  That the reason the place is 
crawling with armed maniacs is US foreign policy?  Look at 
any country outside Europe and the USSR-as-was: if it's got 
serious armed trouble, it's almost certainly been caused by 
US foreign policy, and often direct involvement from the CIA 
which is famous for starting wars and encouraging the 
illegal drug trade.

The USA has been supporting global international terrorism 
for *decades*.  And now, some people have got a bit pissed 
off at that and have decided to do something about it.  Tough 
shit, suckers: you're just reaping what you sowed.  Who was 
it ensured that Saddam Hussein stayed in power?  Armed 
him?  Advised him?  Helped *him* build underground 
military bases?  Oh dear: it was the USA, wasn't it?  The 
USA was the country which arranged for Iraq's invasion of 
Kuwait.  Short sighted morons that you lot are...  If you 
support evil bastards like that, you can hardly be surprised if 
they turn round and bite you from time to time.

I know that the assumption has always been that it's okay 
for the USA to fuck over as many other countries as it likes, 
because the USA is obviously impregnable.  Now we're in 
the 21st century, you're maybe ready for a 20th century truth:  
you can be fucked up by other people just as easily as you 
can fuck them up.  And the USA has fucked up a *lot* of 
other people, who resent the USA very deeply as a result.  
There's a lot of hatred out there, and it's caused by the USA 
shitting on people from a great height.  Act like a bastard, 
and you'll be treated like one.  Tough shit: you're just going 
to have to learn to live with it.  You're going to have a lot of 
other people killed in the USA because of your shitty 
treatment of the rest of the world.  The more people you 
threaten, and the more you kill, the worse it will get.  Happy 
hunting, fuckwits.

The idea that large-scale terrorism which is based on a 
culture can be stopped with violence is infantile.  It's often 
been tried and it's never worked in the past.  Yes, yes, the 
USA can nuke all Islamic countries out of existence.  That 
will also destroy the USA with fallout - or are you too stupid 
to realise this?  There are real solutions to the problem of 
terrorism, but they don't involve the sort of idiocy I've heard 
from countless feebleminded Yanks over the last few 
months.  Oh, you're Texan and you don't like me calling you 
a Yank?  Fuck off and die, shit for brains.  You're all Yanks in 
my book, and `Yank' translates to `feebleminded, insular, 
and ignorant'..

It's a shame the USA has unusually idiotic government at 
the moment which does think that terrorism can be solved 
with violence.  Hopefully Dubya won't last for a second term 
and you'll elect a president of slightly higher intelligence - a 
cabbage, perhaps.  Hell, even a carrot would be better at 
making speeches.

Meanwhile, the USA is becoming steadily more isolated 
from the rest of  the world.  Maybe the rest of us - that's 96% 
of the human race - will soon be able to pretend that the 
region between Mexico and Canada just doesn't exist.  
That'd be nice.  If Dubya really does make the USA vanish 
up its own arse, the primary cause of international terrorism 
will be gone and those of us who live in the civilised world 
will be able to just get on with it.

Oh, there *is* a solution to terrorism - my home country is 
implementing it right now.  It involves killing nobody - if you 
do kill people in the attempt to get rid of terrorism, you will 
simply suffer more terrorist attacks.  It's a pretty simple 
equation.  I don't have to worry about being blown up by 
terrorists any more because my government knows this.

If you're a US citizen, live in fear: you deserve it.  *You* 
elected the governments that caused all these problems - 
it's your fault that the WTC was destroyed.  Are you adult 
enough to take responsibility for this?  No, I thought not.

Have nice day


From: Walter
To: Amazed
Date: Fri Jan 4 03:27:04 2002

Message:
I'm a U.S.citizen,and I don't live in fear at all!Ya see,we have 
GUNS here,and some of us wouldn't hesitate for a second in 
putting it to a third-world terrorists head,and pulling the 
trigger several times.....hows that?
 Most of the rest of the world can't even feed itself,let alone 
pull any kind of bullshit with the U.S..Remember,if there is no 
more America,most of the rest of the world will starve to 
death,and our love of foreigners is quickly fading.Ask Iraq how 
it's doing since we've cut off food,medicine,and other supplies.
 It's sad that you're afraid to post your nationality,but not 
unexpected.

From: om/cf
To: Amazed & Walter
Subject: Amazing
Date: Fri Jan 4 06:58:13 2002

Message:
We've all heard the rantings of Sir Amazed before I believe. But
the new twist was the thought America should just go home and 
stay home......and wait to be attacked for that as well. Fuck 
that!
 Many Americans are well aware of foreign policy blunders that
were mentioned in the Amazing & Amusing post. Water under the 
bridge. As far as Americas current action againt terrorism, its
the only route to take. Id like to see a little more intensity
to it though.
 Now I'll assume Amazed is from England, and for his credibility,
assume England has never made any foriegn policy mistakes and is
loved all around the world. Then why is England so involved in 
the war on terrorism? You have no worries of an attack, correct?
You also have zero gun violence, because you have no private gun
ownership, correct? Maybe Amazed (cough, cough U.K. Voices, 
cough) you have some issues in paradise as well.
 Got to get work, wish I had more time to chat, cheerio.

From: Get a grip
To: Know it alls
Subject: Go surf
Date: Fri Jan 4 09:40:33 2002

Message:
Your opinion is showing, pull up your pants! True, hate is a 
poor excuse for anything. But guess what, it is also a netural 
response to danger. One of those things called Survival 
instinct! If a bear fears for his cubs, he kills! So get used to 
it. We are not about to "turn the other cheek on this one" There 
is a time for every purpose under heaven. Oh shit there I go 
again quoting songs from the age of aquarious. 
             GET A GRIP! 

From:
To:
Date: Fri Jan 4 12:49:57 2002

Message:
Arafat is a terrorist.

From:
To: Amazed
Date: Fri Jan 4 12:51:59 2002

Message:
Amazed....tri a speell chackr for cry'n out lawd!

From:
To: Amazed
Date: Fri Jan 4 12:55:17 2002

Message:
BTW....shut up idiot

From:
To:
Date: Fri Jan 4 13:58:57 2002

Message:
.....The Pentagon is trying to persuade remaining al Qaeda 
members in Afghanistan to surrender by dropping leaflets which 
contain an altered image of Osama bin Laden in Western-style 
dress. The two-sided paper shows an image of dead Afghan 
soldiers, with the statement, "Usama bin Laden, the murderer and 
coward, has abandoned al Qaida. He has abandoned you and run 
away. Give yourself up and do not die needlessly, you mean 
nothing to him. Save your families the grief and pain of your 
death." 

From: Get a grip
To: Flyers
Date: Fri Jan 4 14:39:17 2002

Message:
Cool, they can't read anyway. A picture tells a thousand words. 

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Fact Finders, Merlyn
Date: Fri Jan 4 15:34:45 2002

Message:
Fact Finders: In regards to the question in your post dated (Wed 
Jan 2 23:18:11) I can only guess that the indigenous Afghani 
population will, by and large, be supportive of action taken in 
Iraq, in so far as they will not take reprisals against peace-
keeping troops and the U.S. special forces looking for bin 
Laden's henchmen in the coming weeks and months. The bulk of the 
populace hopefully recognise that those forces are NOT there to 
colonise their country, but simply to stabilize it. Many 
although battle hardened over decades, are also war weary, and 
if smart would see better returns for themselves by 
concentrating their efforts into rebuilding their nation, with 
the eventual aim of becoming a soveriegn independant state that 
can determine it's own future. There have been isolated 
incidents involving coalition troops, including a fatality 
today, but in the scheme of things it's minor, when taking into 
account what has happened in the past three and a half months. 
They would be ill-advised to start taking pot shots at peace-
keeping troops when they are only there to help. With the world 
community acting in unison the economic benefits to them and 
their nation through financial aid etc are obvious. Already the 
swift conduct of the Afghan conflict has resulted in food 
supplies being available to most of the country. Due to the 
steadfast resolve of the U.S. lead coalition, the Taliban/al-
Qaeda regime in Afghanistan has been removed, the bulk of the 
population now have access to food and provisions to help them 
survive the winter. There's a deafening and frankly not 
surprising silence Fact Finders, from those detractors who 
opposed this conflict, some who have written to this board. Not 
to gloat in any way, it's simply a fact, the U.S. and the U.K. 
with the backing of supportive nations were proved right, in the 
manner in which this conflict was conducted. I hope that those 
in Afghanistan realise that troops stationed there at present 
represent countries that wish them the best in their hope of 
becoming a law-abiding 21st century nation, instead of an 
outlawed drug-producing 10th century one.

Merlyn: Sir, with general reference to you prior posts.

In the archives I have stated previously that I am not 
religious. I do not wear that fact like a badge of honour, but 
it does perhaps allow dispassionate assessment of religious 
belief systems. As has been demonstrated over recent months, 
although those who carried out the attacks cannot by definition 
of their actions be true muslims, I, like you, have been worried 
by how many who proport to follow Islam also defended the 
actions of those terrorists. For the peaceful practitioners of 
Islam, a number of whom live in my country and the U.S. the 
realisation that such individuals perpetrated these acts in 
their name and Islam, is something they struggle to comprehend. 
I feel for those people. For the others, one wonders what 
proportion of those who follow Islam are made up of the people 
who gloated when the attacks took place. Too many. From my 
understanding, Islam, like the other main religions is comprised 
of different denominations ranging from the enlightened to the 
extreme. Those who fit into the latter category are 
uncomfortably high. Large sections of Islamic thinking requires 
a long period of introspection for it to fit into the modern 
world. There are those who viewed this conflict as 'a clash of 
civilisations' others simply as a misunderstanding between 
cultures. I think the truth lies somewhere between the two. If 
such introspection does not occur and others aren't willing in 
any way to find out more of other cultures, that clash of 
civilastions may well be on the cards...or the runes. Let's hope 
all concerned use their brains, to avoid such an event.

Thanks for the prediction...that's what I like..an optimist!!! 
and thanks for hanging in there! Everybody slings mud about what 
other people's countries did in the past, so counter 
productive..if not non-productive. Few if any nations have an 
unblemished past. In a sense the world started over on Sept 11. 
It was a defining moment for everybody. I hope this focuses the 
minds of world leaders to act responsibly and wisely on behalf 
of the people they represent. The U.S. should be justly proud of 
how it has responded thus far, that coming from a non-American, 
so please except my compliment. 

As a final thought, you're learing Welsh I believe....in-keeping 
with the name! The Welsh I understand are fiercely proud of 
their language and culture, you don't know it yet 
Merlyn......but you've probably already been made an honourary 
Welshman!, ever thought of dual-citizenship?:-)           

From:
To:
Date: Fri Jan 4 18:08:40 2002

Message:
"Usama bin Laden, the murderer and coward, has abandoned al 
Qaida. He has abandoned you and run away. Give yourself up and 
do not die needlessly, you mean nothing to him. Save your 
families the grief and pain of your death."

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Everyman, Open Mind/Closed Fist
Subject: Currency
Date: Fri Jan 4 17:41:16 2002

Message:
Everyman: It just so happens, quite coincidentaly of course, 
that Tony Blair was going to the Asian sub-continent this month. 
How convenient, no rest for the wicked huh!, and he thought he 
could take it easy, hahaha!...oh, and Tony, while you're 
sightseeing, try to prevent India and Pakistan from starting a 
nuclear war........and how was you're day!!

We in the U.K. don't have Euro's yet, I have yet to be 
convinced. Us, Denmark and one other country who's name at this 
time escapes me, haven't been lead down the garden path yet. It 
basically means our own government has less direct control over 
our economy, and once accepted, the decision to go 'Euro' is 
irreversable. You stick with the Dollar and we'll stick with 
Sterling. How about changing the Dollar to 
the 'Americana'...sound good!?....no.....perhaps not huh.:-). 

I take it the snipe hunting didn't go as planned! Hope you've 
had a good start to your year sir!

Open Mind/Closed Fist:   

Jay Leno used to be on nightly, on something called N.B.C. 
superchannel...it's now unavailable, I prefered him to David 
Letterman, that top ten list of his just goes right by me. In 
comparison to "I laughed my ass off.."...well....there's just NO 
comparison is there? 

Stock market's looking up of late, yours that is.....things 
progressing as they should. Like I said to Everyman, I'll hold 
fire on the Euro...for a while, I mean...would you swap the 
greenback? As for Amazed, there is a ring of familiarity to an 
extent, but to use his words......why DID he bother?...his only 
good question really. Oh well..:-)  

From: boxer
To: johnny jihad
Subject: justice
Date: Fri Jan 4 20:32:09 2002

Message:
Johnny, 

  It is only a matter of time before you are executed.

From: boxer
To: Walter
Subject: a message for you
Date: Fri Jan 4 20:51:00 2002

Message:
Fuck you, pussy.

From: om/cf
To: boxer
Subject: Jihad Johnny
Date: Fri Jan 4 21:07:03 2002

Message:
Dear John will not be executed. I'll bet you 1,000 Euros he 
wont. As Walter said, he will profit so much he could do 5 years
in prison standing on the ball of air that is his head. I know
Walter is no fan of John Walker either.
 How about the 20th hijacker? Court TV wants to broadcast his 
trial so he incite all the Muslims of the world. I have never 
watched this Court TV but I want to encourage all Americans who
read this to boycott that fucked up 'all mighty dollar' program!
They are worried about Mohmmad, or what ever his name is today, 
getting a fair trial. Give me a fucking break please!
 But trying to talk to Taliban John through this forum is a 
little weird dude.
Boxer,
It is only a matter of time before your head is extracted from
your arse.

From: om/cf
To: All
Subject: Highjackers Trial
Date: Fri Jan 4 21:44:27 2002

Message:
I would like to see Zacarias Moussaoui tried by Judge Judy! She
would have him spewing Muslim hatred for America 60 seconds into
the trial! Hell she had me ready to punch her smart ass out the
few times I've watched the show and I wasnt even involved! I can 
see him starting to spout out, Allah this and Allah that, and her
telling him if Allah is your witness you should have brought him 
to court, now SHUT UP, YOU ARE NOT AS SMART AS ME ON YOUR BEST 
DAY!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Open Mind/Closed Fist
Subject: Online betting..
Date: Fri Jan 4 22:02:04 2002

Message:
You bet him 1000 Euros!?, hmmm...that's about 4 dollars isn't it?

From: om/cf
To: U.K. Citizen
Subject: A good bet?
Date: Fri Jan 4 22:22:36 2002

Message:
I hope your right on $4, thats all I can afford to lose after
Christmas.

From: om/cf
To: U.K. Citizen
Subject: Shhhhh
Date: Fri Jan 4 22:40:04 2002

Message:
Live Rates as of 2002.01.05 03:26:49 GMT.  
1.00 EUR
Euros   =   0.895200 USD
United States Dollars 
1 EUR = 0.895200 USD   1 USD = 1.11707 EUR   
 

From: Walter
To: boxer
Date: Fri Jan 4 22:36:40 2002

Message:
LOL!!!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Open Mind/Closed Fist
Subject: One smart bookie
Date: Fri Jan 4 22:31:56 2002

Message:
4 Dollars or not, I'd reckon you're bet's a safe one, likewise 
for Reid. Maybe they'll team up afterwards, go on the comedy 
circuit, but then who'd act the straight guy when their both 
wacko.

From: Merlyn
To: U.K.Citizen
Date: Sat Jan 5 00:39:01 2002

Message:
Creative and optimistic thinking is the format for peace, time 
is short. My every thought and effort is in your heart as it is 
in mine, like a lock the needs a key. The world knows this now. 
For this is the dawn of light and no evil can hide from it. 
             /|\

From: Still amazed
To: All you morons
Subject: Macho posturing
Date: Fri Jan 4 23:56:34 2002

Message:
I was right: you're idiots.  Before anyone criticises my 
spelling, you'd better remember that I won't speak corrupt 
American English.  For example, when I say `arse', I mean 
`arse'.  An ass is a kind of donkey, not a backside.

Yes, the USA contains guns.  And still you think that means 
you can get rid of terrorism by shooting people.  Tell me, 
fuckwits, how did guns stop the WTC attacks?   Boy oh boy 
they were really useful, weren't they?  All you NRA fuckwits 
blazing away really helped there, didn't you?  Yeah, guns are 
great, aren't they?  Sure you can shoot down an airliner with 
a M16, can't you?  Sure.  Sure you can stop hidden terrorist 
bombs blowing up by pulling your death-dealing penis 
extension from your pocket and lobbing a few .44 magnum 
rounds into the air.  Sure.  Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're so hard 
and manly, aren't you?  Yeah, yeah, yeah, you can kill a 
person: don't you understand that it *doesn't stop 
terrorism*?  No, you just don't get it, do you?  Typicaly 
fucking Yanks - quite unable to comprehend that anything 
outside your own narrow perceptions even exists.

Nah, you're infantile, stupid, narrow minded, cowards.  You 
dare not face reality.  You don't have the courage: any threat, 
and you run to the idea that guns can protect you.  Doesn't 
work, and never has done in this sort of case.  Even with the 
example of the WTC attacks, you still have this idiotic idea.  
Getting rid of terrorism takes brave men: brave men who will 
put down their weapons and negotiate.  You need brave 
men to do that - show weakness or fuck up, and you end up 
dead.  It takes *real* men to get rid of terrorism, men with 
the courage to face death, face it down, and break on 
through to the other side: civilization, not casual murder.  
You lot aren't brave enough for that.

Over here in Europe, we know what to do about terrorist 
threats.  There are lots of techniques - since the WTC 
attacks, suspect airliners have already picked up armed 
fighter aeroplane escorts.  Shooting rogue airliners down 
with air-to-air missiles: *that* can work, that can, not 
privately owned bullet shooting guns.  We're not pussy cats 
like you over the USA: we've had to live with death raining 
from the sky, cities being destroyed, you name it (Me?  I'm 
too young,  but my parents grew up in that world, and *their* 
parents did the fighting which kept my country free from 
invasion).  We know what it's all about and we know how to 
deal with it.  You wimps with handguns just can't cut it.  What 
would you do if you saw a cruise missile flying overhead?  
My dad's used to that: he used to run out into the street to 
watch them.  You lot would just run and hide, wouldn' t you?  
Wimps.

Learn this lesson: guns can win wars.  Guns can even stop 
small-scale terrorist organizations.  Both jobs have been 
done.  Using guns to stop culturally-based terrorism has 
*always* made that terrorism worse - every time.  So if you 
want to have more large-scale terrorist attacks in the USA, 
you go ahead and start shooting.  Just make sure you stay 
at home when you do it, eh?  We don't need you.  Go home, 
stay home, fester in your own filth.  You're only 4% of the 
human race: your country could vanish now and the rest of 
us - that's about 6,000,000,000 of us - would be happier, 
richer, and freer.

Y'see, the way it works is this: terrorists understand about 
guns because they have them, usually paid for by money 
from the USA - such as the IRA, for instance.  A lovely bunch 
of chaps, they are, with arms and ammunition  supplied by 
everyone from Libya to the USA (Noraid ring any bells?  
Supplying money so that the IRA could buy AK-47s and 
Semtex to murder innocent men, women, and children. At 
least Ghadaffi didn't lie about what he was doing: he just 
gave 'em the weapons directly knowing exactly what was 
going to happen).  They know about guns and fought with 
guns, rockets, mortars, bombs, baseball bats, you name it.  
And they were fought in kind: with guns, helicopters, 
intelligence inflitration, propaganda, draconian laws, 
staggering brutality on the part of the `security' services (and 
not to mention the reaction of the anti-republicans who 
formed their own armed groups to fight the republicans), 
militarization of an entire province, *everything*.  The result?  
Even more people joined the IRA because the quite a lot of 
the local population *hated* this interference.  Kill one 
terrorist, and three more pop up *if* that terrorism is 
culturally based.  Y'see, us Brits (and our Irish cousins over 
the border) are fighters: we're vicious, nasty, aggressive 
sons of bitches who'll fight anyone, anywhere, any time 
*AND WE WIN* - no Vietnams for *us*.  And when we fight 
each other - well, of course it's messy because we're very, 
very good at it and tend not to give up.  Fighting like that just 
makes more fighting.  One day, you moronic redneck NRA 
members will become extinct and maybe the USA will 
become civilised - but not until you understand this point.

But I was right: you're too thick to understand this.  Guns 
can't protect you against terrorist attacks when that terrorism 
is culturally based.  Guns create more terrorist attacks.  A 
simple equation, but of course you redneck bigots think that 
guns can solve all problems despite the facts of real life.  
Dubya seems to think that too and Dubya is so thick he 
thinks that returning to some form of isolationism will help 
the USA.  It might help the rest of the world provided that the 
USA really *does* stay isolated - after all, we'd rather not 
suffer germ warfare attacks using US-bred weapons (the 
USA being the one country in the world which makes 
biological weapons in industrial quantities for use in 
warfare - ever wondered where that anthrax came from?  It 
derives from US biowarfare labs.  You created that problem 
for yourselves - tough shit, suckers.)

btw, this is the second time only I've ever posted to this 
forum.  My words here can't have been familiar.  Yes, I'm 
British (maybe English as suggested, but, maybe Scottish, 
maybe Welsh, maybe N. Irish, maybe Manx.  How could 
*you* tell?  I didn't mention it not out of fear - what could I be 
afraid of? - but because there was no point.  Virtually no 
Yanks have any understanding of cultures outside their own 
narrow world (how else does the baseball `World Series' 
get that name?  `World' series, when 96% of the world has 
nothing to do with it.  Oh boy, are you guys narrow minded 
morons, or what?) - you're ignorant of virtually everything on 
Earth and think this is something to be proud of).  Yes, we 
have all sorts of crimes here, but the US-funded terrorism by 
the IRA has fallen off rather a lot lately - we've had over 30 
years of bombings, shootings, and who knows what else 
(supported by the USA, the biggest terrorist nation on Earth) 
which was fought in like fashion.  And us Brits (and, as I say, 
our cousins over the border in the Irish Republic) are very, 
very good at fighting, much better than you Yanks.  What did 
fighting the Irish Republican terrorists result in?  *More* 
fighting.  Y'see, fighting culturally based terrorism with guns 
results in *more* terrorism - but of course you rednecked 
fuckwits are too stupid to consider that problems can't be 
fixed with guns.

The solution to culturally-based terrorism is to negotiate.  It 
works, while shooting people causes more terrorism.  See 
why I called you fuckwits and morons?  You have no 
understanding.

Of  *course* we have gun ownership in the UK.  We have a 
stupid government which states that banning handguns will 
reduce handgun crime, which is demonstrably false.  Then 
again, it's demonstrably true that widespread handgun 
ownership of  the sort in the USA leads to a very high rate of 
gun crime and murder.  But then again, the USA is a very 
brutal and uncivilised country which still allows the state to 
murder its own citizens.  I do hope Osama bin Ladan gets 
captured in the EU - he'll never be extradited to the USA if 
*that* happens.

Of *course* the UK government has fucked up foreign and 
all other policies.  The difference between our government 
and that of the USA is that our government - wait for it - 
sometimes learns from its mistakes.  I know that learning is 
a hard concept for bigots to understand.

Happily, international terrorism is being fought pretty 
effectively by organizations unrelated to the USA.  Now if only 
the USA would stop funding international terrorism,  the 
world might be a nicer place.

Yes, Yanks: go home, stay home, vanish up your own arses, 
and sit and wait for what happens.  I want you to do that so 
that if you insist on shooting terrorists, you do it at home 
which will only encourage terrorism inside the USA.

Why?  Because the rest of the world has had enough of the 
USA creating terrorism - either by giving money and guns to 
terrorists directly, or by fucking up countries to encourage 
people to take up terrorism.  It's funny that you're all so up in 
arms about the *USA* now suffering because of this, but 
you've only got yourselves to blame.  Suffer, fuckwits; you 
deserve it.  *You* elected the morons who got you into this 
mess, now grow up and live with it, if you're brave and adult 
enough to do so.  Of course you're not: you rave on like 
spolit 5 year olds who've lost their dolly.

We don't want you, we don't need you, and as for the idea 
that the rest of the world couldn't feed itself without you - 
where *have* you been?  The USA provides almost no 
foreign aid at all (look at the figures, if you will - when was 
the last time the USA paid its full dues to the UN, for 
example?)  while at the same time screwing vast amounts 
of money from the poorest countries in the world (ordinary 
commercial activity and various forms of high-level 
diplomatic bullying), supporting terrorist dictators who help 
screw even more money out of third world countries, and 
sometimes just starting wars when all else fails.  The USA 
is the primary cause of mass famine.  Without you, there'd 
be bugger all starvation on this planet.  You're fucking up the 
rest of the world - is it any wonder the USA is resented?

Those countries which do have famine trouble have that 
trouble *because* of US involvement - your goverment of the 
corporations, by the corporations, and for the corporations 
ensures *that* much.

Luckily for most of the world, this doesn't matter much: 
you've ensured that Mexico stays fucked, but the bulk of the 
world's population lives in countries like India and China 
which are big enough to tell the USA to drop dead any time 
they like, which is why they don't have famine trouble.

This level of ignorance is as expected from Yanks.  After all, 
most of you never even leave your own country - is it any 
wonder that you have trouble understanding anything 
outside the terribly narrow confines of your own tiny - 4% of 
the human race - parochial culture?

Why do I bother with this?  Someone's got to say it, and I 
quite enjoy venting spleen against parochial idiots.

From: Amazed
To: Can you read?
Subject: Euro zone
Date: Sat Jan 5 01:10:17 2002

Message:
Sweden, Denmark, and the UK are the three EU countries 
not using euros.

I like the idea of the UK switching to euros.  The name's 
stupid, the currency looks ugly, but the great thing about it is 
that it'd stop the UK government fucking up financial policy 
quite so much - with control split between the corrupt and 
antidemocratic EU bureaucracy and our home-grown 
fuckwits, the UK economy stands a decent chance of being 
rebuilt and becoming half-stable.

Not that my opinion matters; the UK will join the euro zone 
within a decade no matter what anyone says.

From: JERUSALEM LOVER
To: AMAZED
Subject: WOW
Date: Sat Jan 5 03:18:54 2002

Message:
WOW!! YOU REALLY DESERVE A CLAP OF HAND..I MEAN WOW!! REALLY. I 
HOPE ALL OF YOU MORANS OUT THERE READ THIS AND REALLY KNOW WHAT 
HES TALKING ABOUT..I'VE HAD THIS IN MY HEART SO LONG AND I 
REALLY DIDNT KNOW HOW TO SAY IT AND EXPRESS IT AND AND THIS IS 
REALLY TRUE COMING TO THAT I MYSELF LIVE IN THE UNITED STATES. 
AND ONE MORE COMPLIMENT..ALL OF THIS GOES BACK TO THE 
GOVERNMENT.TRUST ME..ITS THEIR FUCKED UP JEWISH PLANNING..THIS 
IS WHAT THEY WANTED..AND WANTED FOR THEIR PEOPLE TOO..THEY 
ALLOWED GUNS..SEX..DRUGS..CIGERETTES..EVERYTHING JUST TO TAKE 
THEIR MIND OFF THE POLITICAL THINGS..YOU WANT SEX??WE'LL GIVE 
YOU SEX..LET HOOKERS STAND ON ROUD SIDES..YOU WANT ALCOHOL..GIVE 
THEM ALCOHOL..DRUGS..THERES ALREADY DRUGS IN THE 
COUNRTRY..GUNS..LET GUN LEGAL..THEYRE TRYING TO CREAT 
PROBLEMS..SO MANY PROBLEMS FOR OURSELVES AND WHY?? JUST SO WE 
WONT EVEN WANT TO THINK ABOUT ANYTHING ELSE..ANYTHING 
POLITICAL..ANYTHING WANTING TO DO WITH THE WORLD OUT SIDE MY 
HOME AND JOB..NOW WHAT?? WHO DO YOU SEE ASKING QUESTIONS??HUH?? 
WHO?? WHO IS ASKING WHAT IS THE MAIN REASON USAMA BIN LADEN IS 
DOING THIS TO US..WHY DOES HE HATE US THIS MUCH?? IS THIS A GET 
BACK?? OFCOURSE THEY DONT KNOW..BECAUSE THEY DONT CARE. AND THIS 
IS AMERICA IF YOU WANT THE TRUTH..IT ALL GOES BACK TO THE 
GOVERMENT.. AND ALL A BAD SYSTEM FROM THE ROOTS.

From: Walter
To: amazed at everything
Date: Sat Jan 5 04:35:03 2002

Message:
The USA provides almost no 
                foreign aid at all (look at the figures, if you 
will - when was 
                    the last time the USA paid its full dues to 
the UN, for 
                    example?)__________________
 We built the building,we own the soil.Get together,and move the 
HQ if ya don't like it,sis.

And us Brits (and, as I say, 
                  our cousins over the border in the Irish 
Republic) are very, 
                  very good at fighting, much better than you 
Yanks._________________________________________________

 Great!Then maybe you'll be able to explain why we needed to send 
money for FOOD for Great Britain in the 1950's,and why we needed 
to come to your aid in WWII.Seems as though you're getting good 
at firing off your mouth,but getting your brain to fire up is 
another matter entirely.

Yes, Yanks: go home, stay home, vanish up your own arses, 
                  and sit and wait for what happens.____________

 Don't like what we do?Declare war on us.

Getting rid of terrorism takes brave men: brave men who will 
                     put down their weapons and negotiate._______

 Maybe you should think waaaaaay back oh say........20 years 
ago...a place called the Falkland Islands.............anything 
coming back,bumblehead?


Luckily for most of the world, this doesn't matter much: 
                  you've ensured that Mexico stays fucked, but 
the bulk of the 
                   world's population lives in countries like 
India and China 
                   which are big enough to tell the USA to drop 
dead any time 
                     they like, which is why they don't have 
famine 
trouble.___________________________________________________

 This has to be the most idiotic thing I've ever seen typed.
Have you EVER seen a newspaper?Watched Television?India not have 
food troubles?LOL!!!!! In China in the 1930's people had been 
resorting to canibalism,but you'll probably see that at least 
they didn't starve.LOL!!
 You sound as though you think you're part of an elite group.I 
regret to inform you that the uneducated are less discriminatory 
than you obviously believe.

From: U.K.Citizen
To: All
Subject: Iraq
Date: Fri Jan 4 23:04:06 2002

Message:
The Irag Foundation (it states)..is a non-profit, non-
governmental organization working for democracy and human rights 
in Iraq, and for a better understanding of Iraq's potential as a 
contributor to political stability and economic progress in the 
Middle East. It's offices are based in the U.S.

Their site highlights a piece by Michael Dobbs (Washington Post 
Foreign Service).

Old Strategy on Iraq Sparks New Debate (Dec 27.01)

Three years ago, the man who is now White House counterterrorism 
chief drew up a plan for the overthrow of Saddam Hussein. It was 
never implemented, but from today's perspective the strategy 
devised by retired Army Gen. Wayne A.Downing for toppling a 
tyrannical regime has a familiar ring to it.

As presented to congressional leaders in a secret session in the 
summer of 1998, the Downing plan included several elements that 
have proved remarkably successful in Afghanistan. A former U.S. 
Special Forces commander, Downing believed that vicory would be 
achieved through a potent combination of U.S.-backed insurgents, 
massive enemy defections, elite special operations units and 
U.S. air power.

Dismissed by Clinton administration officals as a recipe for a 
second Bay of Pigs, the Downing plan has become highly topical 
since the Sept 11 terror attacks and his own subsequent 
elevationto a key White House position. The general's ideas have 
become a lightning rod for a new debate in the Bush 
administration over what to do with Saddam Hussein, a durable 
and ruthless dictator who is widely believed to be developing 
weapons of mass destruction.

Supporters, who are believed to include Deputy Defence Secretary 
Paul D.Wolfowitz and other important political appointees, argue 
that the Afghan war has demonstrated the feasibility of the 
Downing plan, or something similar to it, and that the moment 
for moving against Hussein is fast approaching.

Opponents, including much of the State Department, C.I.A. and 
professional military, say the plan greatly overestimates the 
strength of the Iraqi National Congress, a London-based umbrella 
group that has established itself as a quasi government in 
exile. In it's original version, Downing's plan envisaged an 
initial commitment of no more than 5,000 or 6,000 "crack troops" 
to defeat a demoralized Iraqi army of a half a million men, 
assuming that U.S. warplanes were available to destroy enemy 
troop concentrations. But more recent Pentagon estimates of what 
it will take to remove Hussein from power are being sharply 
increased, according to administration and Iraqi opposition 
sources.

Bush administration official opposed to an attack on Iraq have 
stressed the differences military capabilities, "Secretary of 
State Colin L. Powell said recently, "They are so significantly 
different that you can't take the Afghan model and immediately 
apply it to Iraq." Military analysts point out that the Iraqi 
army is nearly 20 times the size of the Taliban forces with 10 
times as many tanks. The Iraqi opposition has less experiance 
fighting the regime than Afhganistan's Northern Alliance. Most 
worrying of all, unlike the Taliban, Hussein may well have 
chemical and biological weapons, or even a crude nuclear device.

Stephen J.Hadley, the White House deputy national security 
adviser, said in an interview that the administration had done 
some "planning and thinking" about Iraq in the spring and early 
summer, but the activity hit "a pause," partly because of the 
Sept 11 terrorist attacks. He said the president and his closest 
national security advisers were preoccupied with the hunt for 
Osama bin Laden and had not addressed the Iraqi question "in any 
systematic way."

"We have a lot of business on our plate," he said.

Nonetheless, the Bush administration has embraced the idea of 
regime change in Iraq much more publicly than the Clinton 
administration did. The key question facing President Bush when 
he eventually turns his attention back to Iraq is whether this 
goal can be achieved at an acceptable political, military and 
diplomatic cost. Earlier attempts to overthrow Hussein were 
dismal failures. Accoding to Iraqi National Congress President 
Ahmed Chalabi, there have been half a dozen U.S.-supported coup 
attempts or insurrections in Iraq since the 1991 Gulf War, all 
of them ruthlessly crushed by Hussein's internal security 
forces. "Every Iraqi officer has drawn a lesson from all this. 
If you associate yourself with a U.S. effort to get rid of 
Saddam Hussein, you will either be arrested or killed," Chalabi 
said.

Popular uprisings against Hussein have fared little better. A 
Shiite uprising in southern Iraq in 1991, a few weeks after the 
end of the war, was put down by tanks and artillery.

A 1995 Kurdish insurrection in the north, half-heartedly backed 
by the C.I.A. and instigated by the Iraqi National Congress 
(INC) was crushed by Hussein in 1996. He played one Kurdish 
faction off against another, executing more than 100 Chalabi 
supporters and effectively epelling the INC from Iraq.

Chalabi blamed his defeat on inadequate support from the U.S. A 
former banker educated at the University of Chicago, he lobbied 
Congress to pass what eventually became known as the Iraq 
Liberation Act, a 1998 law that allocated  97 million to the 
training of anti-Hussein guerilla groups. In the process, 
Chalabi antagonized the Clinton administration, but won the 
support of many conservatives, including Wolfowitz and his 
future boss, Defence Secretary Donald H.Rumsfeld.

Both Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz signed a February 1998 letter to 
President Clinton calling on the U.S. to support an Iraqi 
insurrection. Others who signed the letter and are now in the 
Bush administration include White House adviser Zalmay 
Khalilzad, Defence Department officails Douglas J.Feith and Dov 
S.Zakheim, and State Department officials Richard L.Armitage, 
John R.Bolton and Paula Dobriansky. (According to a State 
Department sources, Armitage has lined up behind Powell as a 
skeptic of the Iraqi National Congress Plan.)

Lending military respectability to Chalabi's ideas was Downing, 
a retired four-star general who played a key role in 
overthrowing Panama's Manuel Noriega in 1989 and ran insurgency 
operations in Iraq in 1991 as the head of the Joint Special 
Operations Command. In the words of an INC offical, Downing 
agreed to put Chalabi's ideas into "Pentagonese."

Downing was assisted by the former C.I.A. agent, Duane "Dewey" 
Clarridge, who ran the U.S. backed contras who fought the 
leftist Sandanista regime in Nicaragua during the Reagan 
administration. Together, the two men drew up a plan to train 
some 200 Iraqi National Congress fighters, who would train 
another 5,000 men to be inserted into southern Iraq from Kuwait, 
where they would seize a deserted air base near the city of 
Basra. According to Clarridge, the logistical support operation 
for Chalabi's fighters would have been "outsourced" to 
mercenaries, including U.S. Special Forces members.

"the idea from the beginning was to encourage defections of 
Iraqi units," recalled Clarridge, who was indicted  for lying to 
Congree in connection with the Iran-contra scandal but pardoned 
by President George Bush just before the end of his 
administration. "You need to create a nuleus, something for 
people to defect to. If they could take Basra (Iraq's second 
largest city and major port), it would be all over."

Even though it became the basis for the Iraq Liberation Act, the 
Downing plan was savaged by much of the U.S. military 
establishment, including officers of Central Command, or 
Centcom, which would bear responsibility for military decisions 
against Iraq. Last year, Cmd Another C.Zinni, then Centcom's 
commander, derided the plan as a prescription for a "Bay of 
Goats" dreamed up by "some silk-suited, Rolex-wearing guys in 
London." In testimony to Congress, Zinni said he had counted 91 
different Iraqi opposition groups, not one of which had "the 
viability to overthrow Saddam."

Richard Perle, an assistant defence secretary during the Reagan 
administration and intellectual force behind the anti-Hussein 
campaign, called Zinni's comment "outrageous."

Perle said, "It is not easy to get allies (for such an 
operation) when you have the Centcom commander saying it can't 
work. He argued that the Afghan military campaign shows that it 
will be virtually impossible for Hussein to mass his forces 
without getting hit by U.S. warplanes.

Iraq "is like a honet's nest," says Micael Rubin, a scholar from 
the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, who has travelled 
widely in Kurdish-controlled sectors of northen Iraq. "And when 
you're dealing with a nornet's nest, you must either get rid of 
it or leave it alone. The worst thing you can do is hit it once 
or twice with a stick, stir up all the hornets, and then walk 
away."

Which, he added, is precisely what the United States has been 
doing for much of the past decade.

The hornets nest analogy refers in part to the country's 
complicated ethnic makeup. The Kurds, who account for roughly 25 
percent of the poulation, now control the northern 10 percent of 
Iraq, with only minimal interference from Hussein's security 
forces. The Shiites, who are strongest in southern Iraq, make up 
more than 50 percent of the population.

Traditionally, Iraq has been ruled from the center, by minority 
sunni Muslim clans, with a population share of just 20 percent. 
(hussein is a Sunni from the town of Tikrit, on the Tigris River 
north of Baghdad.) The U.S. has been very reluctant to interfere 
with this governing formula, which explains why, up until 
recently, the preferred U.S. option for getting rid of Hussein 
was through a coup d'tat among his ruling circle rather than a 
Shiite Kurdish insurrcetion.

If the insurrectionary route is chosen, the problem becomes 
which faction to back. As an umbrella group claiming to 
represent many opposition groups, Chalabi's Iraqi National 
Congress has enjoyed great support on Capitol Hill because of 
its moderate, pro-Western views, but many U.S. oficials doubt 
that Chalabi has much influence inside Iraq.

While the Kurds can field the strongest fighting force against 
Hussein - up to 70,000 men, they have been let down and betrayed 
so many times in the past that they are unlikely to join a 
rebellion without "cast-iron guarentees of sucess," in the words 
of a Kurdish official. Prior to a Washington-brokered peace 
agreement in 1998, rival Kurdish factions spent much of their 
time fighting each other.

The most active opposition force in southern Iraq is an Iranian-
backed guerrilla group, the Supreme Council of Islamic 
Revolution in Iraq. Since the draining of the marshes of 
southern Iraq by the Hussein regime, the Supreme Council has 
switched its focus from liberating territory to a low-level 
urban insurrection, including bombings and occasional mortar 
attacks. The group has refused financial support from the United 
States on the grounds that it does not want to be viewed 
as "Amercian puppets."

"The Afghan model can be applied in Iraq, there is no difficulty 
about that," sadi Hamid Batayi, the group's London 
representative. He added, however, that Washington should work 
through the United Nation to cloak its actions in Iraq 
in "international legitimacy." A serious U.S.-backed 
insurrection will succeed, he siad, but there is great 
skepticism about half-hearted measures.

Similar reservations are evident among Iraq's neighbours, whose 
logistical support would be essential to any sucessful U.S. 
effort to overthrow Hussein. Advocates of the Downing plan said 
they believe they can count on at least tacit support from 
Turkey and Iran, and possibly Saudi Arabia. But the only country 
that seems willing to sign up in advance for such an operation 
is Kuwait, which was liberated from Iraqi occupation by U.S. 
forces in 1991.

================

The above post is in due acknowledgement of theE.S.D.s efforts 
thus far...and to show that I have been paying attention.:-)

From: Everyman
To: Amazed
Subject: Log in your eye?
Date: Sat Jan 5 05:19:43 2002

Message:
Hmmm....AMAZING!
I see the Brits are "blameless"...


British Occupation (1882-1952) 
Ismail's son Tewfiq Pasha reformed the Egyptian economy and 
relinquished financial control to the British who began to run 
the government of the country. Egyptian nationalists, horrified 
at Tewfiq's submission to the British, forced him to appoint 
their leader Ahmed Orabi as Minister of War, but the European 
reaction was swift and violent. Alexandria was shelled and 
Ismailiyya occupied. Orabi's army was defeated at Tel El Kabir 
and the British reinstalled Tewfiq as a puppet. Orabi was driven 
into exile and Mustafa Kamil became the leader of the 
nationalist movement. 
http://www.arab.net/egypt/history/et_british.html.


Operation "Essential Harvest"
Code-named "Essential Harvest," NATO's intervention under 
British command serves several related purposes:
1. NATO Special Forces will be deployed to directly protect 
the terrorists, including their territorial gains. 
2. The intent is to not "disarm the rebels" but to weaken 
and disable the Macedonian Security Forces as evidenced by the 
pressure exerted by Washington on the Ukraine to discontinue its 
military aid to the Macedonian ARM. 
3. The agreement is intent on instilling an atmosphere of 
ethnic hatred between the Albanian minority and the Macedonian 
majority, which would justify military as well as political 
intervention "on humanitarian grounds." 
4. The "Framework Agreement" lays the basis for the 
installation of a NATO protectorate (similar to that prevailing 
in Kosovo and Bosnia) leading to the destruction of Macedonia as 
a country. 
http://www.foreignpolicy-
infocus.org/outside/commentary/0108macedonia_body.html.

India, The Imperial Post Offices of British India by Mazumdar 
Vol 1, 1837-1914, good historical background material 1990, 450 
pages, cloth, sold out 

Malaya, PH of the Occupation of Malaya and British Borneo 1941-
1945 by Proud 1992, 327 pages, cloth, 8 pages in color, sorry, 
sold out 

British Empire Campaigns and Occupations Near East, 1914-1924, A 
Postal History by John Firebrace A detailed postal history study 
covering over 1,250 markings, 15 maps British, Indian, 
Australian and New Zealand participation in the campaigns in 
Egypt, Gallipolis, Salonica and the Sudan with advance of the 
E.E.F into and through Palestine and occupation of Palestine, 
Syria, Lebanon, Turkey and intervention in South Russia. 1991, 
460 pages with 100 pages of illustrations $125.00 

Palestine, The Postal History of British Palestine 1918-1948 by 
E. B. Proud 1985, 305 pages, cloth, out of print 

Trinidad, British Empire Civil Censorship Devices, World War II, 
Trinidad and Tobago by Wike Development and organization of the 
censor stations, the markings, labels, seals, permits, 
instructional markings and security devices, also covers censor 
numbers allocated to Jamaica and Bermuda. 1994, 80 pages, card, 
UK  15.00, $24.00 
http://www.pbbooks.com/foreignc.htm.


The Independence Hall was erected to commemorate the liberation 
of Sri Lanka from British rule on 4th February 1948. Sri Lanka 
became a British Colony when the British captured the Island on 
2nd March 1815 with the signing of the Kandyan Convention 
between the representatives of the Kandyan Court and those of 
the King of England.
http://origin.atsrilanka.com/cityofcolombo.htm.


The sale of arms to foreign countries is big business - and 
Britain is the second biggest exporter of arms in the world. The 
latest annual report on British weapons sales records the 
granting of more than 10,000 export licences in 1998 to a number 
of countries, including Argentina, China, Colombia, India, 
Mozambique, Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Zimbabwe.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/pakistan/Story/0,2763,196373,00.html.



Iraq 
Capital: Baghdad 
Size: 169 000 sq m Popn: 19 290 000 
This country now occupies what was once Mesopotamia, the centre 
of Sumerian, Babylonian and Assyrian civilizations from BC 6000 
to AD 100. The Romans conquered it in AD 114 and it was ruled by 
the native Sassanids from 266-632. The Arabs invaded in 633 and 
the Turks took over in 1065. The Mongols invaded in 1258 and 
Tamerlane destroyed Baghdad in 1401. It was annexed by Ottoman 
Emperor Suleiman the Magnificent in 1533 and became part of the 
Ottoman Empire in 1638 as the separate regions of Baghdad, Basra 
and Mosul. 
It was occupied by Britain in WWI and put under British 
administration by the League of Nations in 1920, becoming a 
fully independent kingdom under Faisal I in 1932. Britain 
retained political and military control. Faisal died in 1933 and 
was succeeded by his son, Ghazi but the real power was held by 
the pro-Western general, Nuri-el-Said who was prime minister 
from 1930-58. Ghazi died in an accident in 1939 and three-year-
old Faisal II became king with his uncle Prince Abdul Ilah as 
regent until 1953. Iraq signed the Baghdad Pact, which was a 
regional agreement to protect neighbouring countries against the 
USSR, and joined Jordan in the Arab Federation in 1958 with King 
Faisal as head of state. 

Syria 
Capital: Damascus 
Size: 71 000 sq m Popn: 12 958 000 
Part of the Ottoman Empire from 1516 to 1918, this country was 
occupied by Britain and France in 1918-19 
http://www.flick.com/onomastikon/Middle-East/East/Near-East.htm.



77. United Kingdom,London 
 Colonized: U. S. (1776), Hong Kong Canada, India (1947), 
Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Gold Coast (Ghana -- Union 
of GC and British Togo 1956), Nigeria (1960), Sierra Leone 
(1961), Uganda (1962), Kenya (1963), Zimbabwe (Rhodesia 1964), 
Lesotho (1966), Botswana (Bechuanaland 1966), Swaziland (1968), 
Burma (1948), Malaysia (1963), Singapore (1965), Brunei (1971), 
Papua New Guinea (1975), Soloman Islands (1978), Nauru (1968), 
Tuvalu (Ellice Islands 1978), Fiji (1970), Tonga (1970), 
Seychelles, Maldives, Mauritius, Chagos Archipelago (Indian 
Ocean), Cocos (Indian Ocean), Nicobar, Bahamas, Bermuda, 
Grenada, Trinidad, British Guyana, Ascension (Atlantic), St. 
Helena (Atlantic), Tristan da Cunha (Atlantic), Falkland, 
Jamaica, Belize, Vanuatu (New Hebrides 1980)

http://www.world-products.com/countries.htm.


From: Everyman
To:
Date: Sat Jan 5 06:30:27 2002

Message:
Oh, let's not forget Ireland, Scotland, Wales...
"If I were a Welshman..."  yada yada... (remember Tevye)?

From: U.K.Citizen
To: All
Subject: Correction to prior post
Date: Sat Jan 5 06:51:44 2002

Message:
It should of course say...Iraq Foundation.

Information obtained from:

http://www.iraqfoundation.org

From: Everyman
To: U.K Citizen
Subject: Essay Question
Date: Sat Jan 5 07:08:40 2002

Message:
***********
   A+
***********


From: U.K.Citizen
To: Amazed
Subject: Just read it.....
Date: Sat Jan 5 07:45:39 2002

Message:
From two Brits who visited the U.S. this week, they posted this 
article in a British national newspaper:

How strange it has been to be in America over this New Year. 
Stars and Stripes flags are everywhere - jutting from houses and 
apartments, streaming from every other car you pass. It's not 
just the official patriotism you expect from banks, big business 
and hotels but an outpouring from just about every humble 
domestic quarter. It represents a kind of fervent personal 
affirmation from everyone here of their belief in, and love for, 
America.

Can you imagine that in Britian? Yes, I know the Union Jack 
comes out at royal weddings and golden jubilees. But after an 
I.R.A. attack on, say, Canary Wharf, do you see the British 
flags fluttering from every other car in the country?

I don't think so.

TOUCHINGLY, our local store here in the Florida Keys has SOLD 
OUT of Union Jacks as Americans fly our flags along with their 
own. Everywhere you go, when people find you're British, they 
will thank you with overwhelming, sincere gratitude for your 
support. The SLIGHTEST news of British input into the war on 
terrorism is top news on the TV bulletins: "Fifty British 
soldiers move into Kabul," the news anchors approvingly intone. 
It does make you feel humble.


-------------

...and with that said, thanks SO MUCH for your input into the 
debate!. Quite honestly, your first post was itself so hate-
filled it wasn't worth responding to. I presume the, Can You 
Read? reference, refers to me. Thanks, once again, for the tone 
of your remarks. If you wish, I shall respond to you in due 
course, but I'll show you a little more courtesy than you've 
shown myself and others thus far.

From: Freedom
To: Satan Bin Ladin
Subject: Time
Date: Sat Jan 5 09:32:16 2002

Message:
Dear Satan Bin Ladin & dog-friends;
...Hope all is well with you in this new year. I have been 
resting very well as THE GREAT STUD GEORGE BUSH cleans up around 
your old haunts. The people of Afganastan are not afraid of you 
any more. In fact no one fears you anymore.
...The tick-tock of the great clock is growing louder and 
louder. It is the sound of you time coming to an end. Rest 
assured that THE GREAT STUD GEORGE BUSH has authorized your 
death. A U.S. Citizen will drop you where you stand and take to 
his busom you wives and children.
...Your time has ended...
Goodbye
Freedom

From: Get a grip
To: Amazed
Subject: Amazed
Date: Sat Jan 5 09:42:07 2002

Message:
Amazing, you are such a remarkable person, with such profound 
insight. You must be a legend in your own mind!

From: John
To: Still amazed
Subject: Boy, they grow em dumb in Britian, don't they?
Date: Sat Jan 5 10:09:55 2002

Message:
Ya know "Still amazed", I am still amazed, you = (UK Voiceless 
Vomit) are an absolute MORON.  Boy, they grow em dumb in 
Britian, don't they?

John
E..

Hi everyone!!!  I'm back from my holiday.  Hope you're all well.

From: snake~~eyes
To: some of the originals
Subject: I have been busy
Date: Sat Jan 5 11:03:06 2002

Message:
but have a minute to contribute some comic relief.

i realize some here may not appreciate the humour, but here it 
is just the same.


 Now that our B-52's are reorganizing Afghanistan's landscape, 
U.S.
 intelligence has discovered that the Taliban has renamed some 
of their
towns
 to confuse us.
   These new names include:

>   1) Wherz-myroof
>   2) Mykamel-izded
>   3) Oshit-Disisabad
>   4) Waddi -El-Izgowinon
>   5) Pleez-Ztopdishit
>   6) Kizz-Yerass-Goodbi
>   7) Ikantstan-Disnomore
>   8) Wha-Tafuk-Wazi-Tinkin
>   9) Myturbin-Izburnin
>   10) Imma-Dedshmuck
>

From: unknown
To: you
Subject: hello
Date: Sat Jan 5 11:34:10 2002

Message:
FUCK YOU

From: UNKNOW
To:
Date: Sat Jan 5 11:38:00 2002

Message:

From: unknown
To: you
Subject: hello
Date: Sat Jan 5 11:38:56 2002

Message:
FUCK YOU BITCH

From: bitch
To: unknown
Date: Sat Jan 5 12:25:17 2002

Message:
OHHHHH OUCHIE!

From: om/cf
To: Amusing
Subject: Jolly Good Show Old Chap
Date: Sat Jan 5 11:31:10 2002

Message:
Although nothing else you do provide some entertainment value.
Your view of the average American is way off but you are very
expert in name calling and stereotyping. Not very useful in the 
real world, but hey if its your hobby, go for it. You really must
come to America and meet some real people.
 You sure do have a deep seated fear of firearms, oh Im sorry, 
Penises. Americans dont own firearms for the purpose of shooting
down hijacked airliners, you ding dong. They are used for 
hunting, defending ones family and home. If you want to dicuss 
reckless firearm usage, check out those Arabs who shoot into the
air to celebrate everthing from murder to their first woody. I 
noticed Britian is having the same problem with gun violence as
America, even with a total ban of legal handgun ownership. What?
You mean the criminals didnt turn their guns in? IMAGINE THAT!
I know here in America, criminals follow the letter of the law 
when obtaining their guns too. Some of us believe that a legally
armed citizenry could actually overtake a out of control 
goverment if it ever came to that. I dont even belong to the NRA,
even though Moses himself is President!
 Oh, America armed all the terrorists of the world.I have never
heard that before. Please enlighten further with your unending 
knowledge of American arms shipments. Could it be we have also 
helped some countries maintain their freedom?
 As far as the U.N. goes, it would not exist without America. Did
we ask you to pay us back for saving your island in WW2 you 
ungratefull little prick.
 Your intepretation of American crime statistics is truly 
AMAZING! It is a fact that states who have adopted concealed
handgun carry for qualified citizens have lowered their violent
crime rates. Washington D.C. has a ban on handgun ownership and
they have the highest violent crime rate in the U.S. Right in the
nations capitol. Go figure.
 China and India have no hunger problems because they can tell 
the U.S. drop dead? India sure has a funny way of telling us to
drop dead. And hunger releif organizations dont even need to
deliver to China anymore. Good that should get their population 
under control for them.
 Sir, you never cease to AMAZE and AMUSE. Now pop another video
in the player and learn some more American stereotyping. You may
want to learn some manners as well. If you act as you speak you
must be one lonely sonofabitch.
 Anyway, sticks and stones and all.
Have a wonderfull day.



 

From: om/cf
To: Jerusalem Lover
Subject: WOW!!
Date: Sat Jan 5 14:43:23 2002

Message:

From: om/cf
To: Jerusalem Lover
Date: Sat Jan 5 15:03:48 2002

Message:
You had all that bottled up in your little heart and didnt know
how to say it or express it? What, are you fucking deaf and dumb?
I believe you posted a few times before under a different name.
Its good to see you havent wasted your time with actually 
improving your language skills.
 Believe it or not, some Americans actually have the mental 
capacity (smarts) to own guns, have sex, smoke and/or drink the
demon alchohol and still have the energy to keep up with current
events and even our goverment.
 I sure hope you didnt actually pass the citizenshp test. What 
the fuck do you know about the roots of our goverment? Zero. Now
go get yourself one of those hookers you've been eyeballing on 
the roadway. The porno movies just aint cuttin it anymore, huh?

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Jerusalem Lover
Subject: Confessional...
Date: Sat Jan 5 15:29:24 2002

Message:
Bet you're glad you got THAT off your chest 
huh?...Sorry...SORRY!...J.L...slipped up there...I guess there's 
no gambling allowed either in your perfect society...right?, 
forever banished!....along with a variety of other delights. 
Along with you're anti-semitic remarks, you sound like a really 
top guy...and it's says a lot, that someone like YOU 
was 'inspired' by Amazed. Need one say more.

How DO you manage to clap with one hand?  


From: U.K.Citizen
To: Amazed...Do YOU read?
Subject: Ref: Post Dated: Jan 3 23:48:11
Date: Sat Jan 5 18:10:34 2002

Message:
So...where does one start with you. To answer your 
question...yes...I do read...thanks for asking...and Do you 
Listen?. You're being compared to U.K.Voices (check archives), 
he neither read nor listened. Just pontificated from upon high 
from the outset, no courtesy...no apologies....just self-
opinionated verbal abuse. Now if he'd been from somewhere..let's 
say...Tahiti, then he could have afforded to build himself 
the 'proverbial glass house' from which to throw stones at 
others. Tahiti, as a soveriegn island hasn't to my knowledge, 
had ambitions to conquer other countries. Almost ALL countries, 
as I have stated...repeatedly...have at some stage in their 
history, to greater or lesser degrees, conducted acts that shed 
unfavourable light upon them. If you don't believe Britain is 
not one of them, then one can only pressume you didn't attend at 
least three years worth of history lessons, during your formal 
school education. 

Many people on this board are more aware than you think, of what 
our governments and their agencies, secret or otherwise have 
done in our name. Don't seek to patronise, or you'll repeatedly 
come off second best with that atitude. Did YOU know, Saddam 
Hussein was given the red carpet treatment when he visited 
British....yes!...British...army bases many years ago? If you 
did, you're keeping rather quite about it, and if you didn't 
then you're not very smart...are you?, but...you are naive. So 
don't try to pin that particular charge on certain contributors 
to this board. Yes, he was seen as an ally at that time, by the 
West, but International politics are never straightforward, 
anticeptic or pleasant things to deal in, on MANY occasions. 
Sometimes all there are, are despots, and in the absence of 
anyone else one has to deal with them whether one likes it or 
not. Ask Foreign Secratary Robin Cook about his unfortunate 
diplomatic dabblings in Sierra Leone, or the fact that some East 
African nation is buying an ultra sophisticated air traffic 
control system that they cannot afford, foisted on them because 
of British industrial/commercial interests. I'm not blind to 
such hypocracy...WHY ARE YOU? Or have you neglected not to 
mention such cases simply to 'win' the argument. Like I said, no 
major country is immune from such accusations. The fact I've had 
to raise these issues pisses me off about you. People on this 
board quite rightly have had to respond in kind, when their 
country is abused as you have done. So that leads me to think as 
to how much you do in fact love YOUR country, you'd rather have 
it dragged through the mud, just so you can make your pointless 
point of view. The fact that you made such accusions as a first 
post, simply undermines the VALUE of your point of view. So do 
us all a favour please......and take a little trip to reality 
yourself once in a while. Oh, and please....do NOT, give up the 
day job, if you have one, I think your resume' as a diplomat 
fell at the first hurdle, thank God your not working for the 
U.N., World War III would have been and gone and all of us with 
it.

And what exactly...is this?...

Quote:

" Oh, there *is* a solution to terrorism - my home country is 
implementing it right now. It involves killing nobody - if you 
do kill people in the attempt to get rid of terrorism, you will 
simply suffer more terrorist attacks. It's a pretty simple 
equation. I don't have to worry about being blown up by 
terrorists any more because my government knows this."

Unquote.

That...solution... as you call it, involved families, watching 
the killers of their loved ones go free from jail, many killers 
not showing the slightest remorse. Those killed would have 
included the British Troops, members of the then Royal Ulster 
Constabulary, the Garde' and innocent civilians killed in 
bombings and shootings in Eire, Northern Ireland and the British 
mainland. If those people, or those who survived, but shall 
remain maimed for the rest of their lives told me that the price 
that they pay is worth somebody like you, telling the rest of 
us, that it's a simple equation, I'd listen. But I won't listen 
to you, unless of course you have lost somebody as a direct 
result of a terrorist attack. But then of course, your atitude 
wouldn't be nearly as arrogant as it is now. Talk is cheap, 
until you've lost someone.

As for your last paragraph, the fact that you expressed no 
sympathy, in fact quite the reverse...makes you a terrorist 
sympathiser sir. If you're not..then try and explain WHY you're 
not.

        

From: North Carolina Gal
To: everyone
Subject: I'm back
Date: Sat Jan 5 21:53:29 2002

Message:
Just wanted to say Hi! Hope everyone had a Happy New Year...I 
haven't posted for awhile,I've been sick with pneumonia but, 
doing pretty good now...I see that I have alot to catch up on! 
Just wanted to wish everyone the best....

From: om/cf
To: Amazed
Subject: And the difference is.........?
Date: Sat Jan 5 20:58:44 2002

Message:
Over here in Europe, we know what to do about terrorist 
threats.  There are lots of techniques - since the WTC 
attacks, suspect airliners have already picked up armed 
fighter aeroplane escorts.  Shooting rogue airliners down 
with air-to-air missiles: *that* can work, that can, not 
privately owned bullet shooting guns.  We're not pussy cats 
like you over the USA: we've had to live with death raining 
from the sky, cities being destroyed, you name it (Me?  I'm 
too young,  but my parents grew up in that world, and *their* 
parents did the fighting which kept my country free from 
invasion).  We know what it's all about and we know how to 
deal with it.  You wimps with handguns just can't cut it.  What 
would you do if you saw a cruise missile flying overhead?  
My dad's used to that: he used to run out into the street to 
watch them.  You lot would just run and hide, wouldn' t you?  
Wimps.
=================================================================
=====.

 Now call me crazy, but these techniques are exactly what the 
U.S. is doing as well. There is still some question as to what 
happened to the plane that crashed in a lightly populated area 
of Pennsylvania. I told co-workers that morning that plane was 
shot down. I guess we are similar pussycats.
 Please give examples of death raining down from the sky and 
desroying British cities. Was this ww2? And by Cruise Missles 
did you mean German rockets late in the war? And was mom mad at 
dad for coming home late from the pub and getting shot at by 
missles seemed a good excuse at the time?
 My father fought in WW2 recieved the Purple Heart among some 
other decorations my sister keeps. Hell, we had a half brother 
in Austria untill 4 years ago. War is hell!
 I'll be the first to step up and say England took some serious
punishment from German bombing early on in WW2, and the fighter
pilots in their Spitfires and Hurricanes saved England from the
Nazis. I had more Spifire models hanging from fishing line in my
bedroom when I was a kid than I did P-51 Mustangs or P-47 
Thuderbolts and they were carefully hung so they all were on the
tails of the Messerschmitts and Focke Wolfs.

 

From: om/cf
To: North Carolina Gal
Subject: Hello again
Date: Sat Jan 5 22:13:10 2002

Message:
Happy new year! Take it easy and get well. We cant afford any
casualties right now! Hope all is well now.

From: U.K.Citizen
To: North Carolina Gal, Open Mind/Closed Fist, Everyman
Date: Sat Jan 5 22:34:53 2002

Message:
NC Gal: Hello from me too, hope things are O.K. Pneumonia and 
snow drifts in the Carolinas not withstanding. Stay warm!

Open Mind/Closed Fist: Amazing..isn't it!....Wow, juusst 
Amazing. Amazing and his Jerusalem Lover, starcrossed lovers in 
fact, a match made in hell.

Everyman: Thanks for that high mark, I know you're bias in 
favour, but hey..I appreciate it!. I'd have to downgrade myself 
for the typing errors, couldn't be bothered to correct 
them...got typer's cramp. I'll allow myself a B- I think.:-)

From: Amazed
To: You lot
Subject: Hard of thinking
Date: Sat Jan 5 21:12:36 2002

Message:
I see people have been digging up the history books.  Yes, I 
know about the past.  Yes, I know what the British 
government has done in the past.  I know about Britain's 
odious role in history.  But I'm talking about *now*, not the 
past.

(I know about Britain's role in the international arms trade.  
What do I think of that?  I'm glad that it's not just you Yanks 
and the Froggies (I've got very recent French ancestors so 
stop whinging.  The French are quite capable of being just 
as rude about me and frequently are) who are profiting from 
it - if we weren't flogging aeroplanes and missiles and 
whatnot to odious foreign governments, the French or Yanks 
would be getting the cash, wouldn't they?  Selling weapons 
does not cause wars.  Buying them and using them does - 
and if a government wants to buy arms, it can.  The only 
question is `where from?'  What I *can't* accept is Britain's 
disgustingly barbaric role in selling torture equipment: that 
trade is not inevitable in the modern world.)

btw, Britain got bugger all help from the USA after WWII - the 
Marshall Plan (one of the truly decent things to come from 
the USA) was great for the rest of Western Europe, but not 
for us .  What the USA did for Britain after WWII was screw 
us up as badly as it could get away with.  Read the history 
books, eh?  But all that was *in the past*.  I'm talking about 
*now*.

I mentioned that you lot were hard of thinking.  Some moron 
mentioned the Falkland's war.  Well, as I said, guns can win 
wars: that was a war which was won by fighting.  It has 
nothing to do with culturally-based terrorism which cannot 
be beaten by fighting.  Engage brain if you have one.

How much do I love my country?  Not at all: I'm a passionate 
anti-nationalist, anti-bigotry, anti-religious humanist free 
thinker.  The sooner nation states cease to exist, the better 
for humanity.

I know that my country's government is inclined to give good 
treatment to some odious scumbags like Saddam Hussein 
and Gen. Pinochet.  Such treatment is publicised over here 
and widely criticised.  And we don't do things like fund these 
maniacs and then get all hoity-toity when they start doing 
maniacal things to us like you Yanks do.

How about the red-carpet treatment given by the American 
people to terrorist representatives like Gerry Adams?  My 
government might act in an odious fashion, but at least the 
population objects.  Over there in the good ol' USA, the 
American people just *love* showing support for terrorists 
and giving them money.  Which is worse?

(I personally don't like Gerry Adams *at all*.  His number 
two, Martin Maginnis (a genuine ex-terrorist himself - Adams 
is just a politician) is a different matter.  But what I think 
about them doesn' t matter: they seem to be doing a decent 
job at the moment, so (like many others) I'm swallowing my 
distaste and hoping that maybe we're looking at the 
beginning of the end of the recent troubles in (mostly) N. 
Ireland.  There's still too much terrorist activity caused even 
by the IRA proper, but...  The end is in sight, I think.  No 
thanks to the USA, which has been supporting Irish 
terrorism for decades.

Y'see, I don't like the British government.  I lobby against it 
when I can.  I'm opposed to the policies of my government 
and I act against those policies.  Can you understand this 
idea?  When my government acts stupidly, I say so.  When it 
acts in an evil fashion, I say so.  When I see it encouraging 
terrorism, I object.  I don't believe what my government says.  
The average Yank is very different - you're largely very 
parochial (not suprising given that virtually none of you place 
even one foot outside your tiny nation - don't forget that 96% 
of the human race lives outside the confines of the USA), 
and seem to believe what you're told.  In part, this is 
because you're brainwashed by your schooling (if my 
government suggested that the Union Flag be displayed in 
every school classroom, it'd be tantamount to inciting 
revolution.  We don't like that kind of thing over here - the 
mindless jingoism that sort of thing generates causes 
problems which we'd like to avoid).  But *I* come from the 
country which produced the excellent book `Teaching as a 
subversive activity', which is recommended reading on 
many government funded teacher training courses.  Think 
on this.

As for calling me a terrorist sympathiser: yep, I am that.  I 
sympathise with those who have taken up arms in various 
causes: I understand why they do it (which is very different to 
wishing to encourage them or thinking that what they do is 
right).  Ben Franklin: *he* was a terrorist sympathiser who 
whipped up terrorist activity.  George Washington as well - 
he did in fact carry out terrorist acts himself, didn't he?  The 
USA was founded by terrorist activity and has continued in 
that grand tradition.

I'm a communist sympathiser, too: I sympathise with the 
ideals of communism while at the same time despising the 
practical implementation of what has been called 
communism.

My personal politics are of an anarcho-syndicalist nature.

And despite all that, despite my loathing for my government 
and my own rather strange politics, I'm also a supporter of 
the basic British system of running things.  Why?  Because 
pretty much everything else that's ever been tried is *worse*.  
Meet the concept of `loyal opposition'.

Now then, I don't like wars and I don't like terrorism.  So 
what?  I can *sympathise* with the causes of things like 
that.  Sometimes going to war or taking up arms in a 
terrorist fashion is the only solution to a problem.  The 
modern Irish Republic (Eire only if you speak Irish Gaelic, 
which we're not doing here.  Do any of you lot know what 
`Eire' means?  I do.) was founded by such terrorist activity, 
and so it had to be (do some research into the Black and 
Tans if you want to read some real horror stories; the 
latter-day Provisional IRA has no such excuses, and as for 
the `Real IRA'...  Well, they won't last.  I hope).  The same 
applies to pretty much any country which threw out foreign 
control through armed struggle: the USA is the biggest 
example of that.  Yep, you Yanks live in a country which was 
founded by terrorists, and you are taught to venerate those 
terrorists.  You're all terrorist sympathisers if you have 
swallowed the standard line about your `founding fathers'.  I 
personally don't see this as a problem.

I also have sympathy with the innocent victims of terrorism.  I 
have no sympathy at all with those who encourage 
terrorism: the US goverment (elected by the US people) 
encourages terrorism, and the US people have funded 
terrorism with private donations.  The population of the USA 
is *not* an innocent victim: you have caused terrorism 
elsewhere in the world, and now you are beginning to suffer 
from it yourselves.  Tough shit, fuckwits: reap what you have 
sown.  if you don't like it, *stop encouraging and funding 
terrorism* - you're still doing it in Israel.  Elect a government 
that does not do this, stop funding terrorism, and I'll become 
sympathetic.  Until then, you have nothing but contempt from 
me.  Grow up: if you incite terrorism, you deserve to suffer 
from it.  You, the American people, incite terrorism: it's been 
the policy of your government for decades and you Yanks 
have supported this policy (not to mention funding terrorism 
in my country with direct private donations) - but of course 
the bulk of the American people don't care what happens to 
non-Americans, do you?  Until those non-Americans decide 
they've had enough of being shitted on by the USA and fight 
back...  You don't like that, do you?  You thought all those 
guns and missiles and aeroplanes and nuclear bombs and 
ships and soldiers and armed police could protect you 
against anything.  Guns for self-defence?  Doesn't work, 
does it?  You've got some hard lessons to learn: such force 
provides no protection against terrorist attacks.  You cannot 
treat everyone in the rest of the world with the contempt that 
you do treat them and expect to get away with it.

In short, with regard to the horrific attacks on the 11th 
September last year: tough shit.  You've brought it upon 
yourselves.  Grow up, stop whining, and take effective action 
against terrorism: get rid of the terrorists in your own 
government to begin with.  Impeach Dubya for starters, then 
get rid of the CIA. Then stop funding and supporting 
terrorism overseas.  Do that, and you'll have sympathy from 
me.

I understand why the CIA stokes up terrorist activity 
world-wide.  I understand why the FBI has incited terrorism 
*inside* the USA (anyone remember COINTELPRO?).  I 
understand why the poor bloody Palestinians are fighting 
*now*.  I know about my own country's role in *that* 
particular mess (a late friend of mine was out there at the 
time Israel was set up - a lot of *his* mates were killed out 
there due to (Zionist, as it happens) terrorist activity.  I know 
about terrorism, y'see - it's very close to home here).  I know 
a lot more about the history of the British empire that you 
fuckwits.  I know about the horrors my ancestors visited on 
my other ancestors (I happen to know I've got ancestors 
from all parts of Europe, as well as Jewish ancestors, Arab 
ancestors, and Asian ancestors (by Asian, I mean `Indian 
subcontinent; I expect I have ancestors from other parts of 
Asia too, but I don' t know about them) - we're all related).  I 
also know about the terrorist activity visited upon my British 
ancestors by my Nordic ancestors: the thuggish terrorists in 
Denmark, Norway, and Sweden who did so enjoy all those 
viking raids back at the end of the 1st millennium AD.  So 
what?  Scandinavia is now civilised.  Britain is now civilised.  
The past is the past.  The USA is still uncivilised and still 
acts in a terrorist fashion - that's *now*.  The past is gone, 
but you must learn from it unless you want to carry on 
making the same mistakes over and over and over again.

Y'see, I mentioned `learning from your mistakes' .  I said this 
was a concept you bigots would have trouble with, and I was 
right, wasn't I?

I also know that Israel's current policy for dealing with 
Palestinian grievances is terrorist activity itself  - and the US 
government is supporting that terrorism, as it is supporting 
many other terrorist policies around the world.  But fighting 
terrorism with terrorism doesn't work.  Rabin (an ex-terrorist 
just like Arafat) knew that, so the bastards shot him just as it 
looked like a solution to the age-old conflict was in sight.  
He wanted a peaceful solution and might have got one, but 
oh no, we can't have peace between Jews and Arabs, can 
we now?  *YOUR* government is supporting the continuing 
terrorism in the Middle East - do you feel proud to be 
American?  Proud to be wrecking the lives of so many 
foreigners?

*MY* government is not supporting terrorism *NOW* (as far 
as I know they've stopped helping out the anti-republican 
terrorists in N. Ireland), because doing so is stupid and 
causes more terrorism as they found out.  The US 
government *is* supporting and encouraging and funding 
terrorism *NOW*,  and has been for decades.  This is 
because the US goverment thinks that supporting terrorism 
can't hurt the USA - fuckwits.

Oh yes, the reason the UN is situated in the USA is that the 
USA wanted maximum control over it.  If it weren't for the 
USA wanting that, the UN would have been built in a more 
civilised part of the world.  Knock the thing down and rebuild 
it anywhere else?  Good idea - the rest of the world would 
love it - but the US government would go away and sulk and 
refuse to join in at all if that happened.  It's bad enough right 
now, with the USA blocking all attempts to put together 
workable international agreements to stop international 
terrorism, but that's roughly what one would have expected: 
the USA doesn't want to stop international terrorism.  It 
wants to be able to cause as much international terrorism 
as *it* wants, without understanding that the natural 
consequences of that are that it will suffer terrorist attacks.

Yes, I know that lots of British and Irish people are upset at 
convicted terrorist murderers being released from jail.  
That's what I meant about the job of fighting terrorism 
needing brave men: the decision to release these 
murderers is one that only brave men could have taken.  It's 
got to be done if there's going to be an end to the fighting 
over N. Ireland - or are you too stupid to understand this?  I 
don't like it, but I accept reality when I see it.  You're too thick 
for that, aren't you?

`Talk is cheap until you've lost someone'.  Well, I have done.  
I've also come very close to being blown to bits by terrorist 
bombs on dozens of occasions - bombs which might well 
have been bought with terrorist funding from the USA (a lot 
of them were planted by the IRA).  I'm nothing special in this: 
there are hundreds of thousands of people in Britain who 
have missed being killed by the IRA, INLA, or similar by a 
matter of minutes.  You think I'm isolated from terrorism like 
you lot in the USA?  Fuck off and die, shit for brains.  I know 
what it's all about - the cause of the problems, and the 
solutions.  You lot don't - you have no understanding.  I 
repeat: culturally based terrorism has *never* been beaten 
by fighting it in kind.  Read the history books and *learn*, if 
you can.

History teaches us that the only solution to culturally based 
terrorism is negoatiation.  This is hard for some people to 
accept (typical Yank redneck bigots, for example, as well as 
the bigots you can see every day on the news in N. Ireland), 
but if you *really* want to fight terrorism, you must accept 
this and act accordingly.  Many people dislike the 
consequences of this in the short term, but it's the only 
solution to the problem.

As for the idiot who suggest that we should invade the USA 
if we don't like its policies: that's the typical infantile reaction 
I expected.  Western Europe is civilised.  We've given up 
aggressive warfare completely.  We don't need to invade the 
USA: we can do much better by applying economic 
sanctions.  After all, the EU is richer and has more people in 
it that the USA does.  We don't have as many guns, nukes, 
bombs, bullets, soldiers, sailors, airmen, and the like.  
That's because we don't need a huge military force - which 
countries could possibly mount a serious attack on the UK?  
And why would they do so?  No, we've got no worries of that 
sort any more.  Nor does the USA need the military force it's 
got.  It's just that the US government wants to continue to 
subsidise US industry, and so keeps spending your 
hard-earned tax dollars on pointless military hardware.  Do  
you enjoy the thought of spending untold billions on this 
`National Missile Defense' system?  Building a huge 
system which cannot be tested properly (and therefore 
cannot work properly) to counter a non-existent threat?  Your 
cash used to subsidise US big business...

From: North Carolina Gal
To: om/cf & U.K.Citizen
Subject: thanks
Date: Sat Jan 5 23:30:27 2002

Message:
I just turned on the TV and saw where a 15 year old resident nut 
flew a plane into a Bank of America building  in Tampa Florida! 
I can't believe what is going on in this world....Well anyway I 
wanted to say thanks to both of you and yes  U.K. Citizen I am 
staying  warm....Ice Storm here in the A.M.........

From: Amazed agin
To: The hard of thinking
Subject: The US government can't be trusted
Date: Sat Jan 5 23:41:20 2002

Message:
It's not just me who thinks this.  There are US citizens living 
the USA who have grave misgivings about the bastards you 
elect to run your country.  Take a look...

http://www.rawilson.com/prethought.shtml

http://www.rawilson.com/tsog.shtml

From: Amazed
To: om/cf
Subject: And the difference is.........?
Date: Sat Jan 5 23:48:58 2002

Message:
From: om/cf 
To: Amazed 
Subject: And the difference is.........? 
Date: Sat Jan 5 20:58:44 2002 
Message:

Over here in Europe, we know what to do about terrorist 
threats.  There are lots of techniques - since the WTC 
attacks, suspect airliners have already picked up armed 
fighter aeroplane escorts.  Shooting rogue airliners down 
with air-to-air missiles: *that* can work, that can, not 
privately owned bullet shooting guns.  We're not pussy cats 
like you over the USA: we've had to live with death raining 
from the sky, cities being destroyed, you name it (Me?  I'm 
too young,  but my parents grew up in that world, and *their* 
parents did the fighting which kept my country free from 
invasion).  We know what it's all about and we know how to 
deal with it.  You wimps with handguns just can't cut it.  What 
would you do if you saw a cruise missile flying overhead?  
My dad's used to that: he used to run out into the street to 
watch them.  You lot would just run and hide, wouldn' t you?  
Wimps.
==============================================
===================
=====.

Now call me crazy, but these techniques are exactly what the 
U.S. is doing as well.

Could be, but one fuckwit posting here suggesting that guns 
were the solution to that kind of problem.

Please give examples of death raining down from the sky 
and desroying British cities. Was this ww2? 

Yep.  When else has that happened?

And by Cruise Missles 
did you mean German rockets late in the war?

No, I mean German cruise missiles: V1s, aka doodlebugs. 
Pulse jet powered unmanned aeroplanes: cruise missiles.  
The rockets were V2s (`Vergeltungswaffen Zwei' (vengance 
weapon 2; there was a V3 too); von Braun callled 'em A4 
rockets, and they formed the basis of the Apollo 
programme).  They were supersonic:, so by the time you 
heard them, they'd already blown something and someone 
to bits.

 And was mom mad at 
dad for coming home late from the pub and getting shot at 
by 
missles seemed a good excuse at the time?

My dad was a small child at the time.  Kids tended to enjoy 
watching the doodlebugs fly over - it was exciting, as was 
watching dogfights as the spent cartridge cases rained 
down.

My grandparents - my only married close relatives at the 
time - were separated for almost all of WWII because my 
grandfathers were both in the armed forces.  Coming home 
late from the pub was not an option.

 My father fought in WW2 recieved the Purple Heart among 
some 
other decorations my sister keeps. 

Good on him.  I appreciate the sacrifices made by the 
individuals who fought, whatever I might say about policy 
and general attitudes.  And while I certainly don't wish to 
suggest that your dad was anything but entirely praiseworthy 
and a brave man for doing what he did, I've heard that 
Purple Hearts get handed out for the most trivial injury, 
however caused.  It's not exactly a decoration to be 
particularly proud of if my information is correct (FWIW, both 
my grandfathers picked up quite a few medals, and one of 
my grandmothers got a decoration for bravery.  This sort of 
thing was unavoidable for anyone who actually put 
themselves in the danger zone assuming someone else 
was watching).  The fact that he volunteered to fight in WWII 
and did in fact do so - *that* is something to be very proud 
of.

Hell, we had a half brother 
in Austria untill 4 years ago. War is hell!

Well, yes, but Austria's not been at war for a while now, has 
it?  But shall we talk about the odious far-right Austrian 
politicians?  And the way Nazism is still very strong in 
Bavaria?  (Never mind the laws: look carefully, and you can 
still spot swastikas here and there)  Thankfully, those 
scumbags can't do any serious damage any more.

 I'll be the first to step up and say England took some 
serious
punishment from German bombing early on in WW2, 

And on this subject: what the RAF did to Germany later on 
was far, far worse than anything the Luftwaffe did to Britain 
(not just England).  This is a point people tend to forget - the 
Germans get criticised for their `terror bombing', but the RAF 
was even worse for that kind of thing.  Ever been to 
Dresden?  I have: it's *all* new buildings, thanks to the 
RAF...  But, well, when it's total warfare time, it's total warfare 
time: that job was done to win a war that *had* to be won, at 
almost any cost.  The bombing was horrific, but it stopped 
even worse horrors.

and the fighter
pilots in their Spitfires and Hurricanes saved England from 
the
Nazis.

That they did (not to mention all the other pilots, the ack-ack 
units, the spies, the soldiers, and so on), but don't forget the 
poor bastards in the ships who did even more, took more 
punishment, and don't get much of the credit for it these 
days.

 I had more Spifire models hanging from fishing line in my
bedroom when I was a kid than I did P-51 Mustangs or P-47 
Thuderbolts and they were carefully hung so they all were 
on the
tails of the Messerschmitts and Focke Wolfs.

<grin>  Kind of appropriate - after all, it was mainly British 
fighter aeroplanes which fought against the Luftwaffe on the 
Western front (the Russians on the Eastern front had a hell 
of a job: at least the RAF had aeroplanes which were a 
match for the Luftwaffe).  Not that I've got anything but  
immense admiration for anyone who flew a fighter 
aeroplane in combat during WWII whichever side they 
happened to be on.  It's a job that took huge guts.  Flying 
bombers was a job for even braver men (5% casualties per 
raid were not uncommon).  Military flying is a good deal 
safer these days.

I reserve my contempt not for the people who joined up and 
fought (they have my admiration - they're doing something 
*I* dare not do, and protecting my cowardly hide in the 
process.  I know this - call me many things, but don't call me 
a hypocrite), but for the people who think that fighting is the 
solution to all problems, talking about `we should just kill 
the mofos' and all that while not having the guts to join up 
and do the shooting themselves.

Fighting does not solve all problems. Sometimes you've got 
to fight - when that's necessary, get on with it and make sure 
you *win*.  Sometimes fighting makes the problem worse - 
even when the problem *is* violent terrorist attacks.  And 
when that's the case, you've got to swallow your pride and 
wheel out the politicians and diplomats.

From: om/cf
To: Amazed
Subject: Its late, Im tired and goodnight to all
Date: Sun Jan 6 00:46:22 2002

Message:
Our former President Bill Clinton was fond of saying "I feel
your pain" at election time. The current U.S. President George
W. Bush or Dubya, which is popular here too, prefers "You will
feel our pain". I prefer the latter, as do most Americans, 
according to opinion polls.
 Your deep hatred for America is interesting, considering your 
age. You obviously have a good education at least in terms of
history. You must spend a great deal of time surfing the net for
anti- American views. Its funny, I could come back tommorow and
rip a new arse for Britian as well, but there is no point to it.
America and Britian are allied, and this is a good thing for 
both. I could write some hate driven posts calling the Brits all
sorts of names, but I wont.
 I really dont see where you got the idea that Americans are 
standing in the backyard with guns to shoot anything other than
Ducks or Geese out of the sky. I think one post hinted at 
putting a bullit into your head though.
 Oh well, freedom is a great thing that should not be taken for 
granted, correct? In a country such as Iraq, you or I would not 
be so free to vent spleens, as you say. Since I brought up Iraq 
what do you think about freeing those people as well? You 
realize it is in the works as we chat dont you? What is the 
cleanest way to free the Iraqi people? Hold on, you will find 
out. To borrow from a UAE citizen we never hear from, even after
requests reguarding bin Luckys innocence after release of the now
famous tape......................................................
Peace

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Amazed
Subject: Surprised....not quite amazed though...
Date: Sun Jan 6 01:36:20 2002

Message:
After reading your two latest posts, you're tone has 
mellowed...albeit fractionaly. If you've indeed lost ones dear 
to you, then I'm...of course...VERY sorry for your loss sir. 
However,...I stated families...to use a rather stricter 
definition...not a friend/collegue etc. If someone loses 
parents, children, sisters or brothers, those instances, are 
where such losses are...obviously...all the more painful and 
difficult to bare. Regardless, of who was lost, my apology 
stands sir. But I have to ask, and as you did reply...was it a 
close family member as defined?, a simple yes or no, would be 
quite sufficent. I shall bear your loss in mind, when stating my 
replies in future.

Now, back to the war..as Om/cf has been known to say. Don't 
think you're getting off lightly as regarding your replies that 
I haven't made direct reference to as yet. I'll get around to 
them when I can,...so...I really wouldn't advise you start 
resting on your laurals....just yet. Then let's see where our 
comparative stance on issues truly lie...Could be interesting.   

From: Walter
To: amazed at everything
Date: Sun Jan 6 03:29:00 2002

Message:
You're really funny.When I reply and mention the Falklands 
war,you say that was then you're talking about now,then you 
proceed to speak of WWII.That was then also,and since you make 
light of our dead on 9-11,I do not for a second hesitate to give 
a big HURRAH!! to your fuckwit relatives who were too fuckin 
stupid to stay alive.Fuck them,and you also.

What 
                   would you do if you saw a cruise missile 
flying overhead?  
                  My dad's used to that: he used to run out into 
the street to 
                 watch them.  You lot would just run and hide, 
wouldn' t you?  
                                             Wimps.______________

Sounds like your dad was a fuckwit moron.

You think I'm isolated from terrorism like 
                you lot in the USA?If you're a US citizen, live 
in fear: you deserve it.  *You* 
                    elected the governments that caused all these 
problems - 
                   it's your fault that the WTC was 
destroyed.________________________________________

 First we are isolated,then we should live in fear.LOL!!! He 
always makes mention in his posts about 96%of the rest of the 
world;like those are the people on HIS side.Watch:he brings it up 
on EVERY post.He hates the U.S.,he hates his own country,and he 
hates everything,but then its time for 96%again!Sounds to me like 
a spoiled little child who listened to John Lennon sing Imagine 
too many times.I have always been a fan of his music but 
remember: Imagine no possessions,
        I wonder if you can._____________This was written by a 
guy who had around $80,000,000 at the time.

From: aussie
To: western haters
Subject: terrorism
Date: Sat Oct 6 15:06:46 2001

Message:
to all you muslims out there who agree with that fag binladen 
let me hang your nuts on the bombs we drop on your piss poor 
countries

From: aussie
To: fornicaters off binladen
Subject: towell heads
Date: Sun Jan 6 06:43:28 2002

Message:
jealousy can be shown in many ways but to bomb people and hide 
behind a towell and run some say he is a marytr but i say one 
big one right in the middle say goodbye and let our children 
grow up in a peaceful world its the only way

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Snake~~Eyes, Justice
Subject: Comic Relief
Date: Sun Jan 6 08:33:32 2002

Message:
Snake~~Eyes: Don't ever apologise for posting madam, comic 
relief is always welcome...yours included. Besides you got here 
before I did. I suppose one person's joke can be another 
person's insult,....such is the nature of humour. Hey...I ask 
myself number 4...more times than I'd care to admit! By the way, 
did you attend Missin's wedding?

Justice: I remember with fondness that post you did on nudey 
bars...it brought a tear to the eye. I read in the Observer 
online newspaper, that in Kabul there's great kudos in having 
access to satelliete porn channels...in certain quarters at 
least. After the war they've had any distraction is welcome I 
guess. For a supposedly Islamic country however, some would say 
it's healthy...depending on one's point of view, but rather 
hypocritical...if Jerusalem Lover's comments are anything to go 
by. It's that kind of pontificating hypocracy that makes me sick.

I tried to get that Ajeeb.com working, but it didn't work out 
for me. Must have a duff machine. If, there are any interesting 
snippets of information via that source, please let us know. 

From: om/cf
To: Snake~~Eyes, U.K.Citizen & Walter
Date: Sun Jan 6 09:53:32 2002

Message:
Snake~~Eyes: Two thumbs up for funny. Copied and going to work 
with me tomorrow. But only for Bear Fans, not for packer fans. 
When the Bears win today and clinch a first round bye and St. 
Louis loses to give the Bears home field for the playoffs 
everyone (who matters) will be in a jovial mood anyway. Amazed 
hates that we use the name World Series for the baseball, I 
wonder what he thinks about our violent American "football"?

U.K.Citizen: From your dire warning, I sense a calm before the 
storm.

Walter: I also wondered about the mental toughness? required to
watch incoming missles. The 96% to 4% makes US quite the 
underdog, and I like underdogs. Im putting another 1,000 Euros 
on America/Britian over the World!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Open Mind/Closed Fist
Subject: Me?..I'm just gettin' warmed up.:-).
Date: Sun Jan 6 10:44:09 2002

Message:

From: allatti2d
To: Everyone!
Subject: Miss You Guyz
Date: Sun Jan 6 14:20:42 2002

Message:
Hiya Kids...

I have been caught up at work for quite some time and haven't 
had the chance to stop in until now.  I'm headed for Las Vegas 
this week for the (ahem) "Porn Awards" show to work a medical 
booth there, so this might be my only chance to post for a while.

Keep up the good work, everyone, cuz this war ain't over yet, 
not by a long shot!  All the intelligent conversations here 
serve a fantastic purpose, and it should continue.  You know 
there are some educated people here, people who choose to search 
truth and knowlege and share it and discuss it and share new 
ideas and different beliefs and all that good crap.  You guys 
ROCK.

Again, I miss you, I miss this board (sometimes my best source 
of news), and I hope I can get some time in the near future to 
once again involve myself in these discussions.  For now, 
though, Viva Las Vegas!! :)

P.S. - U.K. Citizen, don't stop emailing me!!  Looks like Ashraf 
gave up on me, but I still have faith in you!

From: Justice USA
To: all my friends on here
Subject: USA CITIZENS LARGEST CLASS ACTION SUIT AGAINST USA GOVERNMENT IN HISTORY!
Date: Sun Jan 6 14:29:04 2002

Message:
I am so FUCKEN ENRAGED by our own government fucking us up and 
creating bin laden, et al.  that I propose ALL OF THE USA 
CITIZENS FILE THE LARGEST CLASS ACTION SUIT AGAINST THE 
GOVERNMENT FOR PUTTING ALL OUR LIVES AT RISK WITH THEIR 
STUPIDITY AND ALSO SECRETS THAT THEY KEEP FROM US.  WE HAD A 
RIGHT TO KNOW THAT WE WERE IN DANGER FROM THESE FUCKERS.  THINK 
ABOUT IT.  WHY NOT?  As I have ranted before, if we are TRULY a 
free society, why is it that the fucken government DOES NOT 
LISTEN TO US.  I am tired   of Bush's postering and support of 
Walker.  FUCK THIS SHIT!  HOW CONVENIENT OF THE USA GOVERNMENT 
TO APPLAUD OUR PATRIOTISM, KEEP US BUSY WAVING OLD GLORY SO NO 
ONE CAN LOOK AT THE ENEMY THAT PUT OUT ASSES IN JEOPARDY IN THE 
FIRST PLACE.

From: JERUSALEM LOVER
To: everyone
Subject: yall fuckwits
Date: Sun Jan 6 15:27:06 2002

Message:
WELL I AINT GANNE JUST SIT HERE AND COMPLAIN ABOUT ALL YOU 
FUCKING ASSHOLES WHO SIT HERE AND MAKE FUN OF OTHER PEOPLE LIKE 
ME WHEN THEY EXPRESS THEYRE OPINION...BUT I ALSO HAVE SOMETHING 
ELSE TO SAY ABOUT WHAT JUSTICE USA JUST SAID..THAT IS TRUE..THE 
US HAD A GREAT IDEA ABOUT WHAT WAS GOING ON. THEY WERE EXPECTING 
IT..WHY DO YOU THINK THEY TOLD EVERY PLANE IN THE AIR TO 
LAND..THEY KNEW IT WAS A BIG ACTION AND PLAN AND THEY HAD 40 
TARGETS..YES 40..I MEAN ITS GOOD THAT THEY OLNY GOT AWAY WITH 
THREE BUT STILL....AND NOW WHEN THIS HAPPENED YESTERDAY..DID 
THEY ORDER FOR ALL THE PLANS TO BE LANDED AMEDIATLY??HELL 
NOW..BECAUSE IT WAS UNEXPECTED. AND YOU KNOW WHAT..BECAUSE IT 
WASNT SOME KIND OF ARAB ISLAMIC TERRORIST GROUP IT WASNT EVEN 
PUBLICIZED AS MUCH..I MEAN FOR CHRIST SAKE I JUST HEARD ABOUT IT 
TODAY..THEY DIDNT EVEN MAKE A BIG DEAL ABOUT IT.

From: I am not a lawyer
To: Class Action - Justice USA
Subject: Lawsuits
Date: Sun Jan 6 15:48:53 2002

Message:
I was wondering,  How about this:




USA vs. Israel:
for Israel's killing of US Navy men 
and Israel's sinking the USS Liberty:
http://zog.to/3/liberty/lib-ind.htm




The People of the U.S.A. vs. the USA government:
Tax Rebates for GIVING AWAY over $98 BILLION $$$ to Israel.
And how about all the other foriegn aid too!?!
WHY ARE YOU GIVING YOUR PAYCHECK AWAY IN TAXES TO THEM??
That $98 Billion should go to Social Security,
Health Care, or Education for AMERICANS, not ISRAELIS!
Let them pay for their own bullets to shoot children in the head.
If they want to buy tanks to run over old women,
let them pay full retail price, no more freebees!
That is American Capitalism in action!




Palistine Class action against the U.N.
for sticking them with a bunch of Zionist Racists after WW II.




Palistine Class action against England:
for coming up with that stupid idea in the first place.




The People of Bethlehem vs.  Israel Class Action:
for Israel attacking their city, killing people,
blowing up buildings and running over stuff with tanks.
At least they should pay for the damages to be fixed!




Native American Indians vs. England, Spain, and everyone else...
for shipping over a bunch of people to their country!
(damages with interest, of course).




Africa vs. Europe & the USA...
All blacks should get some money for the suffering of 
their slave ancestors.



China vs. Japan - for various wars and battles.



Mexico and South America vs. sPAIN & the Roman Catholic Church
for all the slaughter, pain and theft of their gold...



Muslim Nations vs. the Roman Catholic Church
for all the slaughter during the crusades.



The Roman Catholic Church vs. Italy
for the slaughter of early Christians by Rome.



South USA vs. North USA
Somebody owes something for all that damage!
Let the World Court find the answer.



IRAQ vs. USA Class Action:
for blowing up their little army boys.


USA vs. IRAQ Class Action:
to repay the expenses of kicking their ass all over the sand.


USA vs. Japan:
for the Alaska and Pearl Harbor attacks.

Japan vs. USA
for Nuclear bombing of two cities.

USA vs. Russia class action:
to repay all the money USA has to spend in Afghanistan.

Russia vs. the USA class action:
for suppling Afghanistan and Bin Laden
to kick the Russians out of Afghanistan.


The list goes on and on and on...






Do you really think a World Court would help, Justice USA?


I think if they really tried to do that,
the World Court would be back logged with cases for 1,000 years,
taking on case after case for the last 10,000 years...


Sad but True...

Why can't we all just get along?
























































From: Bin Laden
To: TO all U.S.A Bitches
Date: Sun Jan 6 16:53:08 2002

Message:
Go to hell I won Ha Ha!!!!!!!!!!

From: Class Action by Survivors?
To: Former USA Military Men
Subject: http://www.ussliberty.com
Date: Sun Jan 6 16:53:49 2002

Message:
That's a good idea.


Could the Survivors of the USS Liberty 
file a joint class action suit against Israel?
(and the wives of the American men killed by Israel, too?)

Here is a nice web site for any survivors:
http://www.ussliberty.com

All Survivors and family members
of those Americans Killed by Israel
should join the mailing list and 
seek a good law firm to file for damages.

Hey if O.J. could get off, then maybe
Israel could get convicted for their bloodshed of Americans.


















From: JERUSALEM LOVER BOY
To:
Date: Sun Jan 6 16:53:24 2002

Message:
WOW!! YOU REALLY DESERVE A CLAP OF HAND..I MEAN WOW!! REALLY. I 
HOPE ALL OF YOU MORANS OUT THERE READ THIS AND REALLY KNOW WHAT 
HES TALKING ABOUT..I'VE HAD THIS IN MY HEART SO LONG AND I 
REALLY DIDNT KNOW HOW TO SAY IT AND EXPRESS IT..................

BECUSS IM A DUMFUK WHO DESERVES THE CLAP OF HAND SYPALIS EATING
AWAY MY BRAIN. I SORRY I YELL ALL TIME, AMAZED NOT SHOW TO 
CHANGE TO SMALL WORDS. 


WELL I AINT GANNE JUST SIT HERE AND COMPLAIN ABOUT ALL YOU 
FUCKING ASSHOLES WHO SIT HERE AND MAKE FUN OF OTHER PEOPLE LIKE 
ME WHEN THEY EXPRESS THEYRE OPINION...BUT I ALSO HAVE SOMETHING 
ELSE TO SAY ABOUT WHAT JUSTICE USA JUST SAID..THAT IS TRUE......

I MEAN WHEN EXPRESS OPINION I SEE BEFORE OF OTHERS. SYPALIS 
HURTS! I LIKE CONSPIRISYS VERY MUCH SO. DAMN I HATE AMARIKA
HOOKER FOR BRAIN PAINS!




From: om/cf
To: all & allatti2d
Date: Sun Jan 6 18:05:13 2002

Message:
Sunday January 6 4:50 PM ET 

Teen Pilot in Tampa Crash Had 'Sympathy' for Osama

TAMPA, Fla. (Reuters) - Police said on Sunday the lone 15-year-
old pilot who stole a small private plane on Saturday and 
crashed it into a high-rise office block in Tampa was 
a ''troubled'' youth who expressed sympathy for Osama bin Laden 
in an apparent suicide note.

=================================================================
 Allatti2d, hello again! Tough job in Vegas but somebody has to 
do it? Good luck. Now if you can hunt up Eagle Eye there is some
fresh meat for him here! Ashraf as well, many were interested in
his opinion on the famous bin Laden 3 or 4 tape, I've lost count.
Late Happy New year to you.

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Jerusalem Lover
Subject: Ref: Post: Jan 6 15:27:06
Date: Sun Jan 6 18:23:03 2002

Message:
The post prior to the one I've just refered to from your good 
self, stated thus:-

"I HOPE ALL OF YOU MORANS OUT READ THIS AND REALLY KNOW WHAT 
HE'S TALKING ABOUT."

The word ALL in that statement was, I have to assume, directed 
at everybody on this board. If someone called you a MORAN...how 
would YOU react?

I do not post here with the intention of making fun of anybody, 
EVERYBODY...as I have said...repeatedly...has every right to 
express their opinion, no matter what that opinion might be. The 
reason I had a go at YOU, was because of the line I've quoted 
from your post. If you insult those on this board either 
generally or specifically...then don't expect not to receive the 
same in return.

To repeat, I FULLY welcome your right to express your opinion, 
though I may not agree with it.

From: North Carolina Gal
To: Jerusalem Lover
Subject: Moran?
Date: Sun Jan 6 21:13:17 2002

Message:
What is a MORAN?  or did you mean Moron.....Just wanted to make 
sure I knew where you were coming from!

From: Get a grip
To: Parents
Subject: planes & kids!
Date: Sun Jan 6 21:11:29 2002

Message:
Hey! for what the friggan hell is the deal ya twit! Since when 
do 15 year old kids fly friggan planes! And Daddy! what do you 
do when your boy says "daddy I think Osama was right, is that 
ok?" Knock some GODDAMN FRIGGAN SENSE INTO YOUR KID YOU IDIOT. 
We do not need any more Johnny Walkers! Pay attention! They 
should make you explain your stupid ass bull shit child raising 
on national TV! Just how many damn times does it take!
 With a strap in hand!
     GET A GRIP!

From: om/cf
To: Get a Grip & NC gal
Date: Sun Jan 6 21:50:55 2002

Message:
Get a Grip: Exactly! A 15 year old is still a child who needs 
someone to talk to and someone to guide them, straight A student 
or not. Once again, everyone around the kid saw signs of 
something not being right and nobody says nothing. Everyone is 
so godamn afraid to hurt anybodys feelings then the kid or kids 
are dead and all kinds of feelings are hurt.
=================================================================
North Carolina Gal: Wasnt Moran the name of the young (at that 
time) actress that played Joanie on Happy Days? Or maybe Moran 
is a offshoot of the Koran. Or maybe he was trying to call us a 
bunch of Mormans.

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Amazed
Subject: Ref: Post Dated: Jan 4 23:56:34
Date: Sun Jan 6 19:14:21 2002

Message:
In light of your latest post, I don't know how fervently you 
still stand behind the post I'm refering to, but nevertheless 
these are my comments.

Your post starts off with a little ranting and raving of your 
own, regarding gun culture in the U.S. I guess going back in 
time to the 'wild west', people felt the NEED to protect 
themselves in the absence of any other form of protection, in 
lawless times/areas, against bands of armed criminals. Given the 
size of U.S., more people therefore I'd assume live/d in 
isolated areas, therefore being more prone to such attacks. Even 
with a police force established, it maybe all over by the time 
the police get there,....if a person's home is violated or 
family...threatened. The vast majority of those possessing a 
rifle or a shotgun in their home, one would assume, were 
responsible, mature people who knew the value of human life. 
They I'm sure, knew the consequences of it's usage. Whether 
that 'vast majority' situation is still the case may well be a 
matter of debate, but is something I cannot comment on with any 
authority, as I don't live there. Personally, I wouldn't want to 
mock a group of people, be it a nation state, or 
whatever..simply because of their history and culture. Guns just 
happen to be a part of America's history and culture.

Personally, I'm quite happy living without a gun in my 
possesion, I've never fired a gun and nor would I wish 
to...unless I'd joined the Army. Firing off a volley of 
expletives on the issue won't change very many people's minds on 
the subject, I'd anticipate.

...and then...Quote:

"Getting rid of terrorism takes brave men: brave men who will 
put down their weapons and negotiate. You need brave men to do 
that. It takes *real* men to get rid of terrorism, men with the 
courage to face death, face it down, and break on through to the 
other side: civilisation, not casual murder. You lot aren't 
brave enough for that."

Unquote.

When three out of the four airliners, used as misiles...smart 
stuff...were ploughed into heavily occupied buildings filled 
with innocent civilians, I doubt bin Laden and his supporters 
were in any mood to do ANY negotiating...whatsoever. In order to 
negotiate with anybody that pre-supposes that they possess 
reason and rationality...some core human values. One can't 
rationalize with the irrational...there's NO POINT in regards to 
al-Qaeda, bin Laden, Mullah Omar, Saddam Hussein (a highly 
intelligent but an irrational megalomaniac) and to a lesser 
degree, three months prior, the Taliban. Fine sentiments 
MAYBE...but completly and utterly USELESS in the circumstances!

Moving on..I qualify only to represent myself, not approximately 
6 billion other people. What makes you qualified to speak on 
behalf of 96% of the world's human population? 

The U.S. economy is the engine room of the economy of the World, 
no matter how much any other trading block or nation to date 
tries to say otherwise. Japan, Europe etc, their markets ALL 
look to the U.S for the lead. That doesn't mean I'm no less 
proud of the fact the U.K. has the largest, most sucessful stock 
market, second ONLY to the U.S. That, our nation, has the 4th 
largest economy in the World and we have only 60 million people. 
I, like you, do not want that achieved through arms sales to 
countries who shouldn't have them. But the fact is the U.S.A. 
economy with it's large corporations, exports jobs to other 
countries, via those nasty multi-nationals like Nike, and such 
like. People may complain factories set up in poorer nations, to 
exploit those people but in the end WE'RE ALL exploited, 
otherwise we would be paid for the work we do, but THEY now have 
the jobs, while the Americans have now...just LOST theirs! These 
people in poor countries don't get paid enough?!!! It's all 
relative, and one HAS to start somewhere. Slowly over time, 
those countries won't any longer be making shoes...they'll be 
making electrical goods...onwards and upwards until their 
standards of living rise. Ask any Amercian, what they think 
about the N.A.F.T.A trade agreement, having all their jobs 
dissappear over the border to Mexico. I'll bet you the Mexicans 
aren't complaining, they maybe poor, but at least they've got 
jobs. Where ethics really come in, is what the BIG shareholders 
of these companies DO with the dividends they receive. They 
should be obliged to plough a portion of that money BACK into 
their home nation and local communities, be it in this intance, 
the U.S.A. If they don't...the greedy fuckers should be jailed 
at the very for a crime not far off being TRAITOR  to their own 
Nation...because that's what it amounts to. Free trade between 
ALL Nations, ultimately, benefits...EVERYBODY. 

I still take it that you'd be quite happy to have bin Laden 
destroy this economy as that was, and still is, his ultimate 
aim. The WORLD'S economy would soon go down the pughole with it, 
and I for one...have no wish to eek out a living at subsistance 
level,....but you're than welcome to it.

(A related issue: As for Prodi's grand scheme for Europe as an 
economic powerhouse, and the Euro...that I'll leave for another 
post.)

Following on, to summize: "Our troops are better than your 
troops America.."...now try and tell me that's isn't NOT macho 
posturing. Playground stuff..

As far as U.S.-based Irish Republican funding is concerned, 
barking at those on this board, as if it's their fault...won't 
improve matters. If you'd bothered to check the archives, I'd 
ALREADY made that point in a civil and polite MANNER!!....For 
your information, and NOT before time, I would AGREE,..this has 
happened.

Sunday Express Newspaper, Jan 6 2002.

Freeze on U.S. funds for terror groups.
(by Yvonne Ridley...NOT my favourite person, but she MAY have 
her good points.)

America has ordered the assets of Irish terror groups to be 
frozen less than 48 hours after a Sunday Express investigation 
revealed how U.S. dollars were paying for Republican bombing 
campaigns on mainland Britain...

...the Bush adminstration reacted swiftly to our investigation 
and outlawed five Irish terror groups. The decision to freeze 
assets was rubber stamped by the U.S. Secretary of State Colin 
Powell. The Northern Irish groups include four Protestant bodies 
named as the: 

Loyalist Volunteer Force
Orange Volunteers
Red Hand Defenders
Ulster Defence Association/Ulster Freedom Fighters

Rebpublican:

Continuity Irish Republican Army

---

The Real I.R.A. was designated a banned organisation by the U.S. 
treasury, two months ago....

Well?

Refer back to my reference to the U.S. in regards to the rest of 
this post. As far as contributions too the U.N. well, 
maybe...just maybe, it's a case of throwing good money, after 
bad, which then ends up the hands of certain leaders of poorer 
countries who COULDN'T CARE LESS about their own people, just in 
lining their own pockets! Nigeria, with all it's vast oil 
reserves is one of the most corrupt countries on the African 
continent. It's leaders are too busy siphoning off money and 
putting them into Swiss bank accounts, just like Zimbabwe's.

Every nation, everybody, has the right to have an equal chance 
in life, whatever continent they live on, and you'd find very 
few on this board who would object to money going from their 
nation, if they knew with GOOD authority it was going to people 
who truly deserved and appreciated that help.              

From: North Carolina Gal
To: Get a grip
Subject: yes
Date: Sun Jan 6 22:08:40 2002

Message:
I agree  with you...If a 15 year old could do this,then anyone 
could....A resident nut or a terrorist, anyone!  Parents should  
take responsibility for their children...If not they should be 
held accountable...I am still in shock that this happened.

From: U.K.Citizen
To: North Carolina Gal
Subject: Spelling
Date: Sun Jan 6 22:24:33 2002

Message:
I realised he'd meant Moron, allowed myself a little sarcasm 
there, but hey..my typing's not up to much either!:-) So anyway, 
how's your son, heard from him lately? 

From: North Carolina Gal
To: U.K. Citizen
Date: Sun Jan 6 22:50:26 2002

Message:
I knew what you meant...and believe me my spelling isn't that 
great either. Thanks for asking about my son..Yes, I have heard 
from him and he says all is well over there..He can't say much 
but, at least I know he's OK...He might be home in March..I'm 
keeping my fingers crossed...

From: U.K.Citizen
To: North Carolina Gal
Date: Sun Jan 6 23:01:44 2002

Message:
When all's said and done, I wish as many people as possible 
involved in this conflict, not least your son, return home safe 
and well. I'm sure you're proud of him. I do hope those weeks 
pass by quickly for you. All the best NC Gal. Keep in touch.  

From: om/cf
To: American & U.K.Citizen
Subject: Remember Ross Perot
Date: Sun Jan 6 22:47:53 2002

Message:
Does anyone remember what Ross Perot said about the N.A.F.T.A 
trade agreement when he was running against Clinton? I sure as 
hell do and America from coast to coast still hears that giant 
sucking sound of jobs leaving this country. Clinton is now 
partying with daughter Chelsea in the whose who night clubs of 
the world on our dollar laughing it up. Oh, he thinks he may 
have made a mistake not getting bin Laden when presented with 
three chances to.
 Slick Willy got my vote the first time around, but not for the 
second term. Its funny because my daughters class at school had
a mock vote and she was the only one to vote for Perot which was
also my choice. 
 In no way is Mexico getting screwed by the U.S. American 
companies are building in Mexico at a unbelievable rate and of 
course the Hispanic populations in American cities are growing. 
What the hell, move to the U.S. and get your 5 tax free years 
here while working or opening a tax free business, then move 
back to Mexico where there are plenty of jobs now. Damn good 
deal for them.

From: Walter
To: U.K.Citizen
Subject: Jan 4 23:56:34
Date: Mon Jan 7 00:41:34 2002

Message:
Fantastic post!

From: Everyman
To: All
Subject: Portland
Date: Mon Jan 7 03:39:46 2002

Message:
Well, we saw the limousine, but didn't get much of a glimpse of 
Bush; met some interesting folks on the bridge into Portland 
whilst traffic was stopped.

There were quite a few protesters there, waving signs and 
wearing flags.  Listening to the conversations as my son filmed 
for his school news program, I heard that Bush is responsible 
for the ills of the world; from the downfall of Enron to the 
bombing of the WTC. (it's all a big conspiracy, you know).  He 
had the towers bombed to avoid facing responsibility for his 
actions in the corporate world...One sign equated him with Bin 
Laden, stating that he is a terrorist as well.

There were a few people there in support of Bush, but they were 
far outnumbered by the protesters, who once the entourage 
arrived, began chanting, "Hey, hey!  Ho, ho!  Corporate 
welfare's got to go!"  

Two girls there stopped for a momentto reflect, "O.K., what do 
you want to chant now?"

Several were complaining about the police officers there, who in 
my view were doing an outstanding job.  They were very polite, 
yet some of the protesters insisted upon pushing forward after 
being asked very nicely to stay back.  One woman was repeatedly 
asked to stay behind the line and kept walking over to the area 
they wanted to keep clear.  An officer walked his horse over to 
ask her (again) to please move over & she began to angrily 
question him, "Why did you have to come CHARGING over here?"  
She tried (with no avail) to bait him into an altercation. 
I heard later that some of the protesters were jumping on cars 
as people tried to drive down the street.  

When Bush left, they were disappointed to see the caravan go out 
another way, and began parading down the street; but it was 
getting windy and cold, so most of them left...

All in all, it was quite educational, and we checked out 
downtown Portland afterwards...which was educational, too!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Open Mind/Closed Fist, Walter
Date: Mon Jan 7 06:31:21 2002

Message:
Om/cf: Recalling the running campaigns of the main candidates 
for the U.S. Presidency some years ago, I too remember Mr.Perot. 
Being a billionaire....he'd obviously been doing some things 
right, no problems financing his own campaign, unsurprisingly. 
Despite his energy and enthusiasm, I think his age and image 
counted against him. He had many things to say that were based 
in common sense. He was a go-getter of the old school, a can-do 
atitude and all that, very positive. If I'd been an American, I 
would have voted for him the first time around. I'm very 
surprised more people didn't.

Not being a U.S. citizen however, his views on the world outside 
the U.S. would be the only things of any real interest to me, as 
you'd appreciate. His two campaigns focused mostly on the 
domestic agenda....never knew his thoughts foreign affairs. 
Image counts for a lot I guess, too few people wanted to vote 
for an old, short guy with a squeaky voice...no matter how 
suitable he may have been.

Walter: Took the word's right out of your mouth?!...just to 
correct myself I meant to say .."..otherwise we wouldn't be paid 
for the work we do.". Thought I'd clear that up:-)    

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Amazed
Subject: Ref: Post Dated: Jan 5 21:12:36
Date: Mon Jan 7 11:43:04 2002

Message:
As far as references to history are concerned, I'd advice you 
read your own posts, because you're the one who made reference 
to history first, through an accusation:

Accusing an entire democratic nation of terrorism and terrorist 
sponsorship as stated in your first post.

Quote:

"The USA has been sponsoring global international terrorism for 
*decades* now."

Unquote.

If you sit down and think for a moment, perhaps you can then 
give your vast mind on opportunity to comprehend WHY, 
everybody "reached for their history books" in the first place, 
in order to counter your argument and draw comparisons about OUR 
country. From all the examples drawn from others,...funny...but 
I don't recall you reacting like a person who wants to take 
responsibility for his country's past. Who does..right? Did I 
hear an apology from you? No...now what did you say?...

"Yes I know about my country's past."

That was the full extent of your acknowledgement....and yet YOU 
want all the U.S. contributors to this board to apologise and 
almost take personal responsibility for " *decades* " of 
terrorism they are alleged to have sponsored?

Again it's amsuing how you accuse the U.S., solely, for the rise 
and rise of Saddam Hussein, when you apparantly knew full well, 
that such details regarding his visit to Britian were "well 
publicised.". Like I said, you kept pretty quite about that one, 
because it just wasn't convenient...was it.

Stop Press!!!!

Quote:

"(I know about Britian's role in the international arms trade. 
What do I think of that? I'm glad it's not just you Yanks and 
the Froggies... 

...who are profiting from it - if we weren't flogging 
aeroplanes, the French or Yanks would be getting the cash, 
wouldn't they?"

My God, that was quick!...now where's are resident Neville 
Chamberlin dissapeared to, our terrorist appeaser, what happened 
to "peace in our time!",..and love...and the global village? 
So.....you're quite happy with Britain selling weapons to 
whatever country wants them, so long as they don't ACTUALLY buy 
them OR use them....oh...COME ON!!!!...what is this?...can't you 
make up your mind? Of course!....you'd only sell armaments 
to 'nice' countries. So how many pacifist nation states do you 
know of, who'd like to buy the very latest in high-tech 
weaponary. Hey listen...If WE dont' somebody else will, is that 
how it is?,....can't say I admire your principles on that one.

Torturing?...stop torturing yourself...and the rest of us...with 
this two-faced drivel and double standards.

O.K. so let's talk about...NOW, because you're the one who wants 
to take a trip down Memory Lane. As far as I'm concerned, all 
the clap-trap about who's got the worst history, the best 
troops...the bigger dick...has so far...courtesy of you, got us 
absolutely nowhere. Aside from 'bravely' putting down all our 
weapons in the face of terrorism, turning the other cheek....and 
all that, what else do you have to offer the world sir in terms 
of a realistic, viable, sensible, non-argumentative solution to 
the world's problems, that DOES NOT involve making you feel 
better about yourself at the expense of everybody else?

So..you don't love your country? Really? Interesting...I guess 
you're quite happy letting al-Qaeda cells operate in our 
country, waiting for that moment, just when smug so and so's 
like you, think our country is untouchable after over 200 of our 
citizens were killed in New York and our armed forcs went after 
those responsible. We're now their enemy...HELLO!!...looking for 
evidence of intelligent life in the world of the Amazed! 

Hey, I'm sure it's a million to one shot according to you, that 
they'll try anything here, but IF they did, what would it take 
to make you change your mind in regards to your dispassionate 
feelings about the country we live in, how many people would 
have to die? You don't love your country...fine. Do you hate 
it?...What? Yet again...IF...you'd checked the archives I sent 
in a post on the very subject of our Union Flag...and the 
American one, and their comparative symbolism. So you're not a 
nationalist, neither am I, I'm a patriot...and there is 
difference...don't ask me to have to explain THAT one to you. I 
ABHOR nationalism, but there's nothing wrong with showing I 
little national pride....for there to be a sense of UNITY...no 
matter WHAT background one comes from. If a nation and all of 
it's people cannot unite under it's flag, it's either ultra-
confident about itself to the point of being oblivious to 
everything, or it's set for civil strife at some point in the 
future. 

I also can't tolerate bigots, I also am non-religious, though 
NOT anti-religious. If you're a humanist, you therefore don't 
believe in god, or in the existance of one. Fine. You then have 
to beleive in something, there has to be a constant in one's 
life, something that can be relied on. If you're indeed a 
humanist, you should beleive in people..right?...I'll tell you 
now...from your posts...it doesn't seem like it!! If you truly 
BELEIVE in people sir, then try looking for the best in them, 
not the worst. Practice what you preach!...look for the best in 
people, whoever they are...and you'll invariably get the same in 
return.

I'll finish off addressing the rest of post specified, at 
another time.   

From: Get a Grip!
To: Big dick!
Subject: small weeeeny
Date: Mon Jan 7 15:22:54 2002

Message:
Just a prick o' misery! Man! Amazed I am! Wow! ho! HEEEEEE HA!
Rolling on the ground laughing! Pleeeeeeeese stop! I just can't 
take it! 

From: Get a grip
To: UK Citizen
Subject: Amazed
Date: Mon Jan 7 15:26:18 2002

Message:
You have a lot of patience! oh boy! WHooooooooooo! How do you do 
it? Seems to me you're stuffing a trash can that's already too 
full! There's just only so much a fool can handle........ 
Oh.....ha! He! HO HO HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE! I just can't 
beleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeive it!~

From: Get a grip
To: all
Subject: Joke/ like I need any more??
Date: Mon Jan 7 17:13:43 2002

Message:
TWO COWS

A Christian Democrat: You have two cows. You keep one and give 
one to your neighbor.

A Socialist: You have two cows. The government takes one and 
gives it to your neighbor.

A Republican: You have two cows. Your neighbor has none. So what?

A Democrat: You have two cows. Your neighbor has none. You feel 
guilty for being successful. You vote people into office who tax 
your cows, forcing you to sell one to raise money to pay the 
tax. The people you voted for then take the tax money and buy a 
cow and give it to your neighbor. You feel righteous.

A Communist: You have two cows. The government seizes both and 
provides you with milk.

A Fascist: You have two cows. The government seizes both and 
sells you the milk. You join the underground and start a 
campaign of sabotage.

Democracy, American Style: You have two cows. The government 
taxes you to the point you have to sell both to support a man in 
a foreign country who has only one cow, which was a gift from 
your government.

Capitalism, American Style: You have two cows. You sell one, buy 
a bull, and build a herd of cows.

Bureaucracy, American Style: You have two cows. The government 
takes them both, shoots one, milks the other, pays you for the 
milk, then pours the milk down the drain.

An American Corporation: You have two cows. You sell one and 
force the other to produce the milk of four cows. You are 
surprised when the cow drops dead.

A French Corporation: You have two cows. You go on strike 
because you want three cows.

A Japanese Corporation: You have two cows. You redesign them so 
they are one-tenth the size of an ordinary cow and produce 
twenty times the milk.

A German Corporation: You have two cows. You reengineer them so 
they live for 100 years, eat once a month, and milk themselves.

An Italian Corporation: You have two cows but you don't know 
where they are. You break for lunch.

A Russian Corporation: You have two cows. You count them and 
learn you have five cows. You count them again and learn you 
have 42 cows. You count them again and learn you have 12 cows. 
You stop counting cows and open another bottle of vodka.

A Mexican Corporation: You think you have two cows, but you 
don't know what a cow looks like. You take a nap.

A Swiss Corporation: You have 5000 cows, none of which belongs 
to you. You charge for storing them for others.

A Brazilian Corporation: You have two cows. You enter into a 
partnership with an American corporation. Soon you have 1000 
cows and the American corporation declares bankruptcy.

An Indian Corporation: You have two cows. You worship them. 




From: Justice USA
To: All
Subject: Asasmma latest whearabouts
Date: Mon Jan 7 17:57:44 2002

Message:
Assama bin laden was last seen with Al Queda's coke in his mouth 
on the top of a tree in Pakistan.  They were also fucking some 
poor donkey.  It is ASSAMA's turn to wear the little dress again 
tonight.......

From: Get agrip
To: Assama But lipps
Subject: 14 year lod boys
Date: Mon Jan 7 18:34:14 2002

Message:
Assama was last seen asking the 14 year old boys to join the 
taliban. Sucking up to one he was smacked by the boys mother and 
given a Burka-ectomy.

From: om/cf
To: U.K. Citizen
Subject: Long Shots
Date: Mon Jan 7 23:06:55 2002

Message:
You are right on about Ross Perots obvious handicaps in this day
and age of constant media exposure. And those funnel cake ears
didnt help either.LOL. But he sure seemed straight forward and
certainly had no monetary reason to run. He probably didnt know 
much in the way of foreign affairs but then again neither did the
current Bush or Clinton. And thats why they hire on cabinet 
people who are supposed experts.
 I consider myself a true independant politically. This past year
I felt Bush was best for the job, so far so good, but a long way
to go under tough times. I also took a look at Alan Keyes, a 
mostly unkown ambassador, black man, and in case AMAZED reads 
this, a strong supporter of 2nd amendment gun ownership rights.
He dropped out early in the primary elections though.
 By the way that was an amazing post earlier. Also the post of 
flag waving. Im a litte more conserative there as well, only a 
3"x6" flag with a suction cup on a side window of our car. 

  

From: Amazed
To: om/cf
Subject: Ignorance
Date: Tue Jan 8 00:38:40 2002

Message:
Your deep hatred for America is interesting, considering 
your 
age. 

You don't know my age and you can't spot the difference 
between hatred and loathing.  Any wonder that I call you lot 
hard of thinking?

You obviously have a good education at least in terms of
history. You must spend a great deal of time surfing the net 
for
anti- American views.

Oh no, not at all.  I've just lived and worked in the USA, is all.  
I've also lived and worked in Germany, as well as having 
visited several other countries for pleasure.  Tell me, Mr 
Parochial, do you even have a passport?

 Its funny, I could come back tommorow and
rip a new arse for Britian as well, but there is no point to it.
America and Britian are allied, and this is a good thing for 
both.

It's a great thing for the USA.  The UK doesn't need it.

 I could write some hate driven posts calling the Brits all
sorts of names, but I wont.
 I really dont see where you got the idea that Americans are 
standing in the backyard with guns to shoot anything other 
than
Ducks or Geese out of the sky.

I got the idea from someone posting to this forum who said 
that Yanks have no fear of  terrorist because you've got guns 
- fuckwit that he is.  Guns don't help against terrorists.

 I think one post hinted at 
putting a bullit into your head though.
 Oh well, freedom is a great thing that should not be taken 
for 
granted, correct? In a country such as Iraq, you or I would 
not 
be so free to vent spleens, as you say. Since I brought up 
Iraq 
what do you think about freeing those people as well?

I think it's a great idea.  A shame that the USA consistently 
supported (with money, military advice, and arms sales) 
Saddam Hussein right up until the threat to Kuwait turned 
up.  The USA is responsible for Saddam Hussain's mass 
murder of his own people.  The USA is also responsible for 
blocking current attempts to control chemical and biological 
weapons, thus allowing Saddam Hussein (deliberately 
inconsistent spelling - read some T.E. Lawrence to find out 
why) to rebuild that part of his arsenal.

The USA is also currently supporting nuclear weapon 
proliferation by blocking the comprehensive test ban treaty.  
Your government talks the talk, but won't walk the walk.  As 
ever...

 You 
realize it is in the works as we chat dont you? What is the 
cleanest way to free the Iraqi people?

Go back in time and stop the USA causing the current 
problems in Iraq that it has by stopping the USA supporting 
the evil madman that's in charge of the country.

Rowland.

From: DON'T TREAD ON ME
To: om/cf
Subject: Frustration
Date: Tue Jan 8 01:15:06 2002

Message:
I agree with your post of a few days ago.  Seems like we 
supposedly corner these guys and they get away.  Everytime our 
Afghan ":friends" can move in for the kill, they negotiate 
a "surrender" and dozens kf not hundreds of bad guys go free.  
Look, I like the fact that our casualties have been minimal and 
that's because we're "using" the locals to do the fighting.  But 
it seems like if these bad guys are slipping the noose (I doin't 
wanna hear anybody talk about a "tightening noose" again), 
they're gonna come back someday down the road.  Bottome line, we 
might as well kill them now, if we're gonna be the ones who are 
gonna have to hunt these bastards down later.  Especially after 
they start using the peacekeepers for target practice.

I agreed with this Omar guy on one point. He once said 
(something like) "As long as there is one Talib left, you (i.e. 
America) will not have won."  I agree. Our job is to make sure 
there is not a single one left.

Case I sound like a blood thirsty lunatic, on September 10th I 
was best pigeonholed as a "bleeding heart liberal."  But now, 
we're talking about self-defense and we gotta do what we gotta 
do. (Profound, huh ?  or eh" as our Canadian friends would say).

From: Amazed
To: om/cf
Subject: Hard of thinking, as I said.
Date: Tue Jan 8 01:02:36 2002

Message:
From: om/cf 
To: Amusing 
Subject: Jolly Good Show Old Chap 
Date: Sat Jan 5 11:31:10 2002 
Message:

Although nothing else you do provide some entertainment 
value.
Your view of the average American is way off but you are very
expert in name calling and stereotyping. Not very useful in 
the 
real world, but hey if its your hobby, go for it. You really must
come to America and meet some real people.

I've worked in Texas.  Next?

 You sure do have a deep seated fear of firearms, oh Im 
sorry, 
Penises. 

Damned right.  Tools for killing are inherently scary - not 
being scared of guns is a sign of stupidity.

Americans dont own firearms for the purpose of shooting
down hijacked airliners, you ding dong. They are used for 
hunting, defending ones family and home.

So how come someone on this forum suggested 
otherwise?

 If you want to dicuss 
reckless firearm usage,

I didn't mention it.

 check out those Arabs who shoot into the
air to celebrate everthing from murder to their first woody. I 
noticed Britian is having the same problem with gun 
violence as
America,

Thick as two short planks, without any idea what's going on 
outside the USA.  We have no such problems with firearms 
as the USA.  Do we have school kids taking guns into 
school and killing kids there?  We do not.  Do we have 
school kids showing how `hard' they are by shooting 
themselves in the leg?  We do not.  I know of two - and two 
only - instances of a nutter doing the mass-murder shooting 
bit in the UK (Michael Ryan in the 1980s, and Thomas 
Hamilton in the 1990s).  I could go on like this.

 even with a total ban of legal handgun ownership. What?
You mean the criminals didnt turn their guns in? IMAGINE 
THAT!
I know here in America, criminals follow the letter of the law 
when obtaining their guns too. Some of us believe that a 
legally
armed citizenry could actually overtake a out of control 
goverment if it ever came to that.

Yep, you're an idiot.  What can a rifle do against a tank 
regiment?  What can a concealed handgun do against a 
surface-to-surface missile attack?  What exactly could an 
M16 or even an AK-47 do against an A-10 `Warthog' ground 
attack aeroplane?  Bugger all in every case (and I've not 
even mentioned the weapons of mass destruction your 
government has ready to use, like chemical weapons, 
biological weapons (both in defiance of international 
treaties that the USA has signed), and nuclear weapons): if 
you think that the people of the USA could do a damned 
thing about an out-of-control government by using guns, you 
are either very, very stupid or you have no conception of 
modern military force.  Your government out-guns the 
people of the USA.

The only country in the world where the government does 
not out-gun the people is Switzerland: in that nation, the 
army is the population.

 I dont even belong to the NRA,
even though Moses himself is President!
 Oh, America armed all the terrorists of the world.

I said you were hard of thinking.  I never suggested that.

I have never
heard that before. Please enlighten further with your 
unending 
knowledge of American arms shipments. Could it be we 
have also 
helped some countries maintain their freedom?

Not since the Korean war and Berlin air lift, you've not.  US 
foreign policy since then has been to take freedom away 
from as many people as possible while supporting as many 
foul dictatorships as possible.  After all, there's nothing 
more importann that making a profit, and lots of goverments 
aren't keen on being taken over by US big business.  They 
put people before profit, you see.  The US government has 
always been opposed to policies like that.  Evil dictators love 
money and don't care about much else, so it seems.

Let's see.  Oliver North?  Heard of him?  Helping support the 
illegal drugs trade in S. America while arming the Contras 
who were fighting against the democratically elected 
Nicaraguan government.  Ever heard of the FBI's 
COINTELPRO work?  Inciting terrorist acts *inside* the 
USA?

How about the Iran/Iraq war?  The USA supporting one side, 
the USSR supporting the other.  Helping maintain freedom 
by encouraging the leader of Iraq to practice mass-murder 
against his own citizens, never mind what he did to Iran.  Oh 
yes, and what about the later US arms shipments to Iran - 
helping maintain the oppressive government in *that* 
counry.

And then there's always Afghanistan: 20-odd years of civil 
war, screwing the people of that country in a right royal 
fashion.  How come?  Well, it might have had something to 
do with the US support for one side in that conflict - did you 
know that the Tora Bora `cave complex' where the Taliban 
hid for a bit was built with CIA money and CIA advice?  Cave 
complex?  Hell, no: a full-on underground military base 
which existed because of US involvement.

Shall I continue?  Oh yes!  Supporting Republican terrorists 
in *my* country - supporting terrorists who did nothing but 
act against the democractically expressed wishes of the 
people of N. Ireland.  And as for US support of current Israeli 
policies...  Well, that's just plain disgusting: supporting the 
suppression of an entire nation (the Palestinians).  I can go 
on and on and on like this for hours.

 As far as the U.N. goes, it would not exist without America.

Well, yes: without it being built in the USA, the USA wouldn't 
have joined it.  And if the USA hadn't joined it, it would be 
meaningless.  Typical Yank arrogance rears its head again.

 Did
we ask you to pay us back for saving your island in WW2 you 
ungratefull little prick.

Yep.  My government eventually told yours to fuck off and die 
on that matter - how about you try reading some history 
books?  And the USA did *not* save this island during WWII.  
By the time the USA joined in, Germany had lost its chance 
to invade: the battles of Britain and the Atlantic had been 
fought and won.  Britain could not have lost by then.  Yes, the 
USA certainly shortened WWII and as a result there was 
something left of Europe by the end - without US 
involvement, Britain and Europe would have been in a nearly 
unrecoverable mess (Germany wasn't far off that state as it 
happens).  But Britain couldn't have been invaded by 
Germany.

When do we hear of the US people thanking us and the 
Soviets for saving *your* nation during WWII?  If we'd not 
fought (in the case of the Soviets, like demons possessed - 
they were being invaded; we weren't), your precious `secure' 
country would be part of the Third Reich by now.  Yes, I 
mean that: if the Germans had had less hassle, their 
nuclear bomb programme would have been finished and 
their intercontinental ballistic missile programme would 
also have been finished.  Missiles dropping nukes on New 
York and other US cities would have been a strong 
argument in favour of the USA surrendering - and *we* 
saved you from that.  As it was, the USA got ICBMs by 
nicking the German work and finishing it off with the same 
German scientists and engineers who'd been trying to 
develop these weapons for the Nazis.  The USSR did much 
the same (the USSR got more of the material but fewer of 
the top workers).

 Your intepretation of American crime statistics is truly 
AMAZING!

I've not even mentioned them.  Is it any wonder I call you 
hard of thinking?

 It is a fact that states who have adopted concealed
handgun carry for qualified citizens have lowered their 
violent
crime rates.  Washington D.C. has a ban on handgun 
ownership and
they have the highest violent crime rate in the U.S. Right in 
the
nations capitol. Go figure.

It's a fact that the UK has a murder rate and gun crime rate 
several orders of magnitude lower than the USA.  Go figure.  
I *said* you were parochial and hard of thinking: a lower gun 
ownership rate results in lower gun crime and lower murder 
rate in civilised countries.  But of course you can't see 
anything outside the USA, can you?

 China and India have no hunger problems because they 
can tell 
the U.S. drop dead? India sure has a funny way of telling us 
to
drop dead.

<shrug>  The USA is trying to fuck up India right now, by 
trying to force it to price drugs out of the reach of Indian 
citizens.  It won't work.

 And hunger releif organizations dont even need to
deliver to China anymore.

Both countries have plenty of food.  They do have money and 
communication problems.  Try ignoring the propaganda and 
think for a change.

Rowland.

From: Amazed
To: U.K.Citizen
Subject: Re: Ref: Post Dated: Jan 4 23:56:34
Date: Tue Jan 8 02:03:32 2002

Message:
Whether 
that 'vast majority' situation is still the case may well be a 
matter of debate, but is something I cannot comment on 
with any 
authority, as I don't live there.

I have done.

 Personally, I wouldn't want to 
mock a group of people, be it a nation state, or 
whatever..simply because of their history and culture. 

I do it all the time.  Why not?

Guns just 
happen to be a part of America's history and culture.

So what? That doesn't mean change cannot occur.  
Genocide, slavery, and institutionalized racism are part of 
the USA's history and culture.  That needs changing too, but 
the racism is still hanging on.

[snip]

When three out of the four airliners, used as misiles...smart 
stuff...

It was pretty clever: who'd've guessed *that* was going to 
happen?  Certainly not me.

were ploughed into heavily occupied buildings filled 
with innocent civilians,

The only innocents in there were the foreigners: those who 
had no part in supporting the US government's evil foreign 
policy which incited those attacks.

 I doubt bin Laden and his supporters 
were in any mood to do ANY negotiating...whatsoever. In 
order to 
negotiate with anybody that pre-supposes that they possess 
reason and rationality...some core human values. One can't 
rationalize with the irrational...there's NO POINT in regards 
to 
al-Qaeda, bin Laden, Mullah Omar, Saddam Hussein (a 
highly 
intelligent but an irrational megalomaniac) and to a lesser 
degree, three months prior, the Taliban. Fine sentiments 
MAYBE...but completly and utterly USELESS in the 
circumstances!

So what?  Some people need fighting, some need 
persuading.  Isn't that what I've been saying all along?  
Osama bin Ladan (the rest of his family's not too bad) 
needs to be caught and locked up because he can't be 
negotiated with.  Killing him would make him a martyr, 
which would be a *really* bad idea.  That's why I hope that 
the USA doesn't get hold of him.

[snip]

What makes you qualified to speak on 
behalf of 96% of the world's human population? 

I've never claimed I was.

The U.S. economy is the engine room of the economy of the 
World, 
no matter how much any other trading block or nation to 
date 
tries to say otherwise. Japan, Europe etc, their markets ALL 
look to the U.S for the lead.

Riiight...  So we're following the US's lead in having an 
economic recession right now, aren't we?  Once upon a 
time, the UK economy was more strongly connected to the 
US economy than anything else.  No longer: we're getting 
freed from that trap.

[snip]

Free trade between 
ALL Nations, ultimately, benefits...EVERYBODY. 

Indeed,  but all governments are currently working *against* 
free trade, most particularly the USA which also witters on 
about wishing to have as much free trade as possible.  
Standard political lies and hypocrisy.

I still take it that you'd be quite happy to have bin Laden 
destroy this economy as that was, and still is, his ultimate 
aim. 

Why?  He's bound to fail, and I've certainly got no wish to 
inflict that sort of suffering on the world.

The WORLD'S economy would soon go down the pughole 
with it, 
and I for one...have no wish to eek out a living at 
subsistance 
level,....but you're than welcome to it.

(A related issue: As for Prodi's grand scheme for Europe as 
an 
economic powerhouse, and the Euro...that I'll leave for 
another 
post.)

Europe is an economic powerhouse now.  The euro (no 
capital letter needed) has already succeeded - it's been in 
domestic use for two years already in virtually all of the EU 
(it's only just now that the actual currency in circulation has 
been changed to reflect this fact).

Following on, to summize: "Our troops are better than your 
troops America.."...now try and tell me that's isn't NOT 
macho 
posturing. Playground stuff..

I know.  What of it?

As far as U.S.-based Irish Republican funding is concerned, 
barking at those on this board, as if it's their fault...won't 
improve matters. If you'd bothered to check the archives, I'd 
ALREADY made that point in a civil and polite 
MANNER!!....For 
your information, and NOT before time, I would AGREE,..this 
has 
happened.

Sunday Express Newspaper, Jan 6 2002.

Freeze on U.S. funds for terror groups.
(by Yvonne Ridley...NOT my favourite person, but she MAY 
have 
her good points.)

America has ordered the assets of Irish terror groups to be 
frozen less than 48 hours after a Sunday Express 
investigation 
revealed how U.S. dollars were paying for Republican 
bombing 
campaigns on mainland Britain...

...the Bush adminstration reacted swiftly to our investigation 
and outlawed five Irish terror groups. The decision to freeze 
assets was rubber stamped by the U.S. Secretary of State 
Colin 
Powell. The Northern Irish groups include four Protestant 
bodies 
named as the: 

Loyalist Volunteer Force
Orange Volunteers
Red Hand Defenders
Ulster Defence Association/Ulster Freedom Fighters

Rebpublican:

Continuity Irish Republican Army

---

The Real I.R.A. was designated a banned organisation by 
the U.S. 
treasury, two months ago....

Well?

Well, after a bit over 25 years of the current round of 
`troubles' in Ireland, during which plenty of money was 
siphoned to the republican side in the N. Irish troubles (that 
is, the side acting against the democratically expressed 
wishes of the people of N. Ireland - fuck me, the USA really 
does help maintain freedom and democracy, doesn't it?  
Trying to bring down a democractically determined nation 
while helping people to live in fear for their lives from 
terrorist activity) from the USA, and just as negotiations are 
beginning to look like we're looking at and end to Irish 
terrorism, the USA freezes these assests.  Bloody 
marvellous, that is.

Well...  Fucking useful act, *that* is, isn't it?  Too little, too 
late.  And why is it being done?  Simply to persuade other 
governments to enact laws to freeze terrorist assests 
outside the USA in order to protect the USA.  I can spot 
hypocrisy a mile off, I can.

Refer back to my reference to the U.S. in regards to the rest 
of 
this post. As far as contributions too the U.N. well, 
maybe...just maybe, it's a case of throwing good money, 
after 
bad, which then ends up the hands of certain leaders of 
poorer 
countries who COULDN'T CARE LESS about their own 
people, just in 
lining their own pockets!

Uhuh.  So because life doesn't work out perfectly and 
because some UN funding goes astray, the USA has 
decided to screw *every* nation in the world.  Great stuff.  
Kiddies dying of avoidable diseases because the UN's 
health programmes have been deliberately underfunded 
due to US action - lovely...

From: John
To:
Subject: Ross Perot
Date: Tue Jan 8 02:32:22 2002

Message:
A little history...

Ross Perot lost the election because the looney tune pulled out 
of the race weeks before election day with the nutty claim that 
republicans threatened his family.  He then re-entered the race, 
but lost all support because we all quickly realized he's 
absolutely nuts.  He sounded kinda like Walter in his early 
posting days.  :-)

John
E...

From: om/cf
To: Amazed & John
Date: Tue Jan 8 06:52:13 2002

Message:
Prince William's 'four-letter fury'
By Sandra Laville
(Filed: 08/01/2002) 

He claimed that the Prince, 19, galloped up and 
shouted: 'fucking piss off, Rowland.'

=================================================================

John: What was the deal with Perots outburst again? Didnt have 
something to do with his daughters wedding or something? But I 
still think his downfall was those ears. lol.
 Off to work again. Good day all.

From: Walter
To:
Date: Tue Jan 8 07:35:42 2002

Message:
A little history...

                Ross Perot lost the election because the looney 
tune pulled out 
                of the race weeks before election day with the 
nutty claim that 
                republicans threatened his family.  He then 
re-entered the race, 
                   but lost all support because we all quickly 
realized he's 
                  absolutely nuts.  He sounded kinda like Walter 
in his early 
                                       posting days.  
:-)_____________________________________________________________

 Yes,and instead of the"Nut",America chose"The Slut",who had 
eight years to catch Osama bin Laden,but was too busy sticking 
his cock in uninvited places.But hey,America got what it was 
looking for:someone to fuck it over.

From:
To:
Date: Tue Jan 8 07:52:31 2002

Message:
As an aussie observer, impartial by blood (no particular 
religion either...), I am sickened by the ignorance in you all 
(with few exceptions). You have no idea how many terrible things 
that America is doing and then lying about. This is not your 
fault - but you will probably already be in denial and already 
ready to reject any conflicting ideas as you read this...

The US have done and are still doing very seriously bad things 
in the poorer countries of the world. (So have the UK, Spain and 
France, Portugal and almost all major world powers throughout 
history. BUT the ONLY difference NOW is that we have instant 
global communication - so in this 22nd century we have a CHANCE 
for truth to reach us in time to react, and a CHANCE to save 
lives and improve lives, and a CHANCE to change our leaders if 
required. AND a chance for me to change your mind...)

The bad things the USA is doing have upset many groups of people 
who have repeatedly tried many ways of negotiating with the USA 
over many years.

The USA needs a massive amount of OIL, TEXTILES and GROWTH 
(either inflation or population) to sustain itself without 
destroying its immediate resources very quickly. So it is using 
the poorer countries like dispensible game peices to achieve a 
monopoly over supply of things like OIL and GAS, etc.

One issue of many: It wants to build pipelines through the Afgan 
country (to be owned and run by the USA) and didnt want the 
TALIBAN being anywhere near the pipeline.  So they want to 
control the Afgan govt so they can guard their new pipelines and 
further control prices by controlling supply.

Thousands of Iraqi children are dying every month because of US 
trade sanctions.

Hiroshima and Nagasaki killed hundred of thousands of innocent 
people...For no good reason...Couldn't the USA have won the war 
anyway? Wasn't it nearly over? 

Over 4000 innocent civilians have already been killed in 
Afganistan...by the USA alone

Come on America - we know your shit stinks just like everyone 
else - you deserved to get the shit kicked out of New York.  
Consider it a wake up call....

Now its time to let the smart Americans get rid of the evil 
American government and start making friends around the world, 
before the stupid USA government kills us all!

I am not the only impartial observer that knows that America is 
going to fuck the whole world over - if it gets a chance.  

Look at the crazy support that the US gives ISRAEL.  Totally 
dispicable - the entire situation. Jews - fuck off and earn your 
own land.  Either fight for it through war - or find somewhere 
else - like everyone else has.

Look at the disproportionate amount of environmental damage that 
the US does....We are watching and we are not impressed.  

The Arabs seem much more like humans from our viewpoint.

And - think about this...ISRAEL stands to benefit the most from 
the WTC plane crashes. Perhaps the ISRAELI undercover 
intelligence agency did it themselves (or at least stopped the 
US from finding out), to make it look like terrorists and 
confuse the issue with Palestine.

Don't worry too much...We have our ignorant idiots too...Most of 
our people believe the USA.  But that number is shrinking...And 
we already usually hate American tourists...for good 
reason...Your government brainwashes you all! Snap out of it - 
and be nice to the middle east, or they will try everything to 
destroy you!  And maybe others might join them if the USA gets 
too carried away... 

I am boycotting any US products that I can. I hope an American 
can feel that.

From: Everyman
To:
Date: Tue Jan 8 09:13:02 2002

Message:
http://www.capsteps.com/

From: Walter
To:
Date: Tue Jan 8 10:19:24 2002

Message:
I am boycotting any US products that I can. I hope an American 
                                         can feel 
that.___________________________

Yes,and I hope you are enjoying your fires!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: to unknown Aussie
Date: Tue Jan 8 09:03:34 2002

Message:
Speaking of denial, perhaps you'd care to drop us a line on your 
views on the Afghan boat people, who arrived in your territorial 
waters prior to Sept 11, and the 'warm' welcome they received by 
the Australian authorities. When your government fully realised 
where these people were originating from, and just how many 
other overcrowded ships were still on their way with perhaps 
still more to follow, please....do correct me if I'm 
wrong.....but a significant, if not huge proportion of the 
Australian electorate voted for a Government who was quite happy 
to send out the Australian Navy to 'greet' these vessels as they 
floundered around your coastline, with no Australian port 
willing to accept them, despite world opinion.

So...with the backing of a very large section of your voting 
public, they in essence, condoned YOUR government's decision to 
tell these unfortunates to "piss off!" somewhere else, or 
to 'escort' them to some God forsaken island in the middle of 
the southern ocean. I'm sure being the libertarian/humanitarian 
you proport to be you'd want this decision 
reversed...right?...O.K then...care to take an Afghan refugee 
into YOUR home...just how far in reality do your lofty 
principles actually take you. Perhaps you'd like to tell us the 
latest on the riots at those cosy refugee camps you've got set 
up on the mainland. Despite Cathy Burke's efforts...how 
many 'aussies' still call the original inhabitants of your 
land.."abbows"? A few more than you'd admit to, possibly?

Your country has some of the strictist entry qualifications 
anywhere, you're REAL choosy about who you take in, whoever 
wants to get in would practicaly have to have a job and house 
set up, BEFORE they even arrived! I wonder......if white South 
Africans turned up in boats on your coastline with nowhere else 
to go, would they be sent to some tiny island in the middle of 
nowhere,...in that instance...there'd be a pretty good chance 
they'd be welcomed with open arms. Do us all a favour, and try 
to acknowledge your own hypocracy before slinging mud at my 
country. Australia's no worse than anybody else, but it's no 
better either...so please climb down off your high 
horse...sport.  

From: John
To:
Subject: ..."I feel your pain."...
Date: Tue Jan 8 10:34:55 2002

Message:
I'm still amazed (no pun intended) how a president with a 92% 
approval rating in November 1991 can loose an election in 
November 1992.  Did we read his lying lips?  Or did the 
supermarket barcode scanner blind him and make him say: "we are 
not in a recession?", opening the door for the cattle-future, 
White-Water rapist to say: "I feel your pain."

John
E...


From: John
To: om/cf or otherwise known as: open mind/closed fist
Subject: ...it's the ears...
Date: Tue Jan 8 11:14:56 2002

Message:
John: What was the deal with Perots outburst again? Didnt have 
something to do with his daughters wedding or something? But I 
still think his downfall was those ears.

==========================

Actually I think we liked his ears till we realized he was 
hearing (little) voices through them.  Republican death threats 
aimed at his daughters alter.  I think maybe we got lucky with 
slut as president.  Ross would have heard the Soviet's (little 
voices) planning against us with all those ears.

John
E...

John
E...

From: U.K.Citizen
To: unknown Aussie
Subject: Name correction
Date: Tue Jan 8 09:03:34 2002

Message:
Before you correct me, Kathy Freeman not Cathy 
Burke...Ms.Freeman being an Australian of aboriginal origin, a 
track athelete who won a gold medal at the last Olympics.

Again..I'm wondering..if she'd finished second, would you kind 
hearted 'aussies' still have seen her as a national hero?......

Face it, she HAD to win...to try to unite her native peoples 
with the rest of her 'kind hearted aussie' compatriots.

From: Walter
To: John
Date: Tue Jan 8 12:57:17 2002

Message:
I think maybe we got lucky with 
                 slut as president.  Ross would have heard the 
Soviet's (little 
                        voices) planning against us with all 
those ears.______________________________________________________

 Yeah....real lucky!Multi-billion Enron robbery,and 2 two world 
trade center towers knocked down,Anthrax scare,billions spent on 
bombs to kill a few thousand,etc.With no end in sight.Too bad 
Cliton couldn't do his fuckin job getting bin Laden like was 
promised in 92,93,95,and 97,maybe we'd have a World Trade Center 
today....and 3,000 more citizens.Lucky.....
 

From: an italian guy
To: the impartial aussie observer
Subject: reply
Date: Tue Jan 8 12:50:46 2002

Message:
Watch, I don't know if you are the same one called 
Cool / John / good thinker, whom once I already answered, 
but I think anyway that answer is good for you.
This it was:

"Your posting is the demonstration of how stupid are the 
reasons of anti-American hatred. As you are going to 
see soon, no inch of this planet has any right to hate 
America but for questionable, or right stupid, or non 
present, reasons. I think you and your fonts are VERY 
biased and non objective. Uncle Sam was often a killer, 
but almost never an assassin. Follows why. 

You call EVERY  U.S. military intervention "terrorism". 
With the common use of this word, military actions for 
legitimate purposes are not called like this. It's as 
if you (and many others) don't know the difference 
between war and terrorism.
You also recall historical events of the 19th century, 
like the war against native-Americans and the niger 
slaves trade, for blaming the today's  U.S.A.. The 
worst thing is that you're saying something like: 
"such country was bombed by Americans, then it does 
have a reason to hate them, too"; and like: "Americans 
bombed Iraq, Libya, Sudan, Afghanistan, Pakistan, 
Japan, Vietnam, North Korea, Laos and Cambodia and 
THEREFORE they are assassins". 

             YOU DO THINK LIKE AN IDIOT.
             ===========================

You don't wont to consider 
WHY they bombed Iraq, 
WHY they bombed Lybia, 
WHY they decided to nuke Japan, 
WHY they bombed Sudan, 
WHY they fought againsts communismus all over the
 world, etceter. 
Because they were bad, or bored? 
You do even know, that Iraq was military attacked 
because of Kuwait invasion and because Saddam 
Hussein was trying to manifacture chemical weapons; 
that the crisis with Lybia was caused from Gheddafi's 
terrorist attacks in Germany (e.g. a bomb in a 
discoteque in Hamburg, many boys and girls dead or 
maimed "for the Arab cause", as Gheddafi said); 
that the Sudan was bombed because manifacturing toxic 
chemical substances for Bin Laden's terrorist attacks; 
that Afghan was bombed as retaliation for Bin Laden's
terrorist attacks against american embassys and an 
U.S. navy unit; that when Japan, Vietnam, North Corea 
and Cambodia were bombed they were in war with the 
U.S.A.; 
that about Algeria you piece of idiot shouldn't even 
talk, after the incredible and barbarous atrocities 
the GIA did (or is still doing) same to other Arab 
people there, in the name of Allah (as usual); 
that, about IRAN, the U.S.A. had their reasons for 
hating Khomeini's regime after the coward attack to 
the American Teheran's embassy, and that's why they 
supported Iraq in it's war against Iran;
that, about Cuba, the O.N.U. enforced the economical 
sanctions for their anti-democratic communist regime, 
for witch is responsible Fidel Castro;
that, about Iraq, if "two million of their children 
have died from economic embargoes which are starving 
the country to death right now" it's Saddam Hussain 
guilty because he's refusing right now to show his 
factories to the O.N.U. inspectors - and himself 
doesn't give a damn for Iraqi dying children, the 
power to threaten all the world with chemical or 
atomic weapons is for him more important, as it 
looks like; 
that, still about Iraq, many Arab civilians died 
because Saddam Hussain used them as hostages for 
protecting his possible targets of bombings.

Then is THIS your thinking way, good thinker?? By 
forgetting those important elements you don't want 
to know?? It's easy, thinking like this. It's easy, 
thinking: "Americans are the ferocious assassins 
of the world, and Islamic people are all quite 
innocent and rightous!". 
You are "a typical self-brainwashed American". 
An intelligent and right person uses his brain to 
objectively discriminating right from unright 
things, and AFTER THAT hates unright things. All 
stupid people in the world (like you) just use 
their brain for finding the way to illuse themselves 
that their hatreds are justified, anyway and at 
every cost.
Before calling yourself "good thinker" you'd better 
learn and apply some concepts like logic and 
objectivity. 

And it's useless that you blame the Americans for 
Israel's military actions. We're talking about the 
U.S.A., now. Even if the U.S.A. support them, 
Israelians act autonomously, and anyway either for 
their direct survival, or for (eternal and 
reciprocal) retailiations against Arab terrorist 
attacks to them.

It's to observe as well what follows.
About the chasing away and the extermination of
many native Americans (that as far as I know were 
about one million and not 25 million), and about 
the niger slaves trade, these obviously were 
giant crimes, but at least they're generally 
admitted as such, now. About Japan, the atomic 
bombs were a very tragical and extreme way to end 
the 2nd ww, but on the other hand a direct assault
to Okinawa would have caused the death of maybe 
more people. 
About the bombings in Vietnam, Americans acted 
with a very heavy hand; and the same did the CIA 
by supporting dictatorships in Latin-American 
countries (e.g. in the overthrowing of Allende's 
regime, etc.); but on the other hand they also had 
to do with another dirty play, the one of the 
Soviet Union, and with the mighty threat of 
communismus.
About the interests U.S.A. demands on loans 
to countries, it's useless to blame the U.S.A. 
for such a "demand", since those conditions 
have been accepted from loan-contracting 
countries (that have benefitted from such 
loans anyway).
About American colonialismus, the colonial age 
is finished since a long time.
About the "over hundred terrorist attacks on 
U.S. targets" that were in 1994 in Latin 
America, it's strange that the media didn't 
talk; anyway, likely they will be a 
consequence of the past CIA operations about 
which I just told.
About pollution in general, you do know that 
guilty is the whole world. 
About the production in the athmospere of 
ozone-spoiling gas, if Americans are the prime 
responsible of it, they should indeed have to 
answer for.
About Malcolm X' murder, it was a political 
crime, for which the then responsibles should 
have had to answer, too.
And for this do Americans deserve to get 
"destroyed"??

You aren't considering, then, that America 
also lost MILLIONS of soldiers by fighting 
against the great nationalisms - do you 
understand? MILLIONS of soldiers - in two 
world wars; 
that since the end of 2nd world war U.S.A. 
contrasted communismus all over the world;
that they intervened in Yugoslavy against 
the Serbs in favour of (Muslim) Serbo-Bosnians 
because of pure justice and humanitary 
reasons - what O.N.U. and European community 
did never make the decision to do - and later 
in favour of (Muslim) Albaneses, for the same 
reasons; that U.S.A. are making NO terrorist 
attacks, but only interventions as 
retaliations to them or for preventing them;
that in their military interventions, 
Americans are usually trying to hit as few as 
possible civilians of the attacked countrys, 
unlike the Islamic terrorists that right want 
to kill as many as possible of them;
that in America's churchs no anti-Arab or 
anti-Muslim hatred is preached, unlike the 
mosquis of all Islamic countries, in which the 
U.S.A. are referred to as "the enemy of all 
Islam" and "the great Satan".
That's why people can't understand the reasons 
of such an anti-American hatred by Muslim 
countries, you fool. 
And OF COURSE Americans are now asking why 
they are hated, why??

If you want to criticise so much about 
freedom in America, then compare the 
American freedom and democracy, with freedom 
and democracy in Islam, in Islamic culture 
and mentality.
Yes, America harbors the worlds largest 
jailed population, 2 million prisoners. Oh, 
Afghanistan e.g. doesn't have such a big 
problem at all. They sentence prisoners so 
quickly to death. By hanging or 
throat-slitting... But maybe you prefer THAT 
culture, don't you? - Well, at least they don't 
tell to be so freedom lovers.... 
(By the way, if you hate U.S.A. so much, if 
you don't believe at all in the American 
freedom or in the idea that America wants to 
have about itself, if you even think America 
should have to get destroyed, if you think 
there you get brain-washed by the media, well 
why do you stay there?)

Besides, if you're so convincted that the 
whole world has real reasons for hating 
America, did you wonder why are now getting 
posted many messages here condamning Osama 
Bin Laden, or in favour of American victims 
of terrorism, from all over the world, and 
in many languages? Why even some Muslims are 
condamning last terrorist attacks? Why  ALL 
countries - even Islamic ones, even Russia 
and China - but Afghanistan, either are on 
the side of Bush or have taken a distance 
from Bin Ladin? Why self many Afghanistan 
people - surely most people, if we consider 
also Afghan women - are against taliban 
terrorists?

And do you know what is a real coward, you 
pig? For example, the one who sits two 
hundred miles off the coast of Saudi Arabia, 
pushing buttons to shoot missiles at an Iraqi 
target is NOT a coward, if this target is a 
mad murderer; while the one who orders a 
slaughter - that is no retaliation for 
anything similar - of thousands of office 
workers and some tourists, and after that 
celebrates the happy outcome of his action 
along with his friends, and then even says 
it wasn't he, that is a BIG coward.

Still, you said a lot of foolish things in 
your message - always as "obvious reasons" 
for the anti-american hatred. Even "countless 
atrocities and accounts of U.S. military 
brutality are coming out of that island 
(Puerto Rico) every day"?? I asked a history 
teacher and looked for this question in two 
enciclopaedyas; nobody had heard about such 
"facts", and I've found no confirmation of 
such every day coming out countless 
atrocities. (October 1950 there was, yes, a 
revolt for independence from U.S.A. that 
ended in blood, but on the other side, short 
later a complete indipendence was proposed 
by Americans but 11-27-1953 a popular 
referendum in Puerto Rico refused it).
About native Americans, instead, I've found 
out that in the territory now occpied by 
the U.S.A. they were about one million before 
American pioneers' arrival, while you said 
that they were 25 million and let understand 
that Americans would have committed a giant 
massacre of 20 million of Indian Americans. 
In addition, you idiot said Indian American 
were "completely wiped out" (?).
You wrote that 35,000 children die "every day" 
due to hunger because of U.S. foreign 
economic policy. I.e. 12,775,000 every year. 
(Let's imagine that!)
You wrote "The righteous Muslims, as well as 
all non-Muslim people who hate tyrrany and 
oppression, declared war on the U.S. a long 
time ago.". Well, the only one who declared 
war on the U.S. a long time ago is Bin Laden, 
who represents all the worst Muslims in the 
world. 
You are capable to call "tyranny and 
oppression" even the war Americans are making 
to Islamic terrorism.
About war in Bosnia you were capable to say 
that the U.S.A. "imposed a lopsided arms 
embargo on the Bosnian Muslims", when it was 
imposed by O.N.U. and on both parts, and the 
U.S.A. rather intervened right in favour of
Bosnians.
YOU ALSO USE EXAGERATIONS AND FAKE 
INFORMATION for illusing yourselves to 
rationalise your big anti-American hatred. You 
and many others in this board want at every 
cost see and let believe that Americans are 
absolute and ruthless slaughterers, and are 
only that. And after the recent terrisist 
attacks you even allow yourself to say "the 
U.S.A. are a justified target for the entire 
world to destroy" - for such stupid or invented 
reasons?. YOU AND ALL THOSE LIKE YOU MUST FEEL 
ASHAMED of being so mean and unright. You are 
stupids and truth-reversing scoundrels. With 
those like you, people can reason no way. People 
can just speak the only language you can 
understand: the one of war and of death."

From: Justice USA
To:
Subject: INSIGNED PEICE OF SHIT AUSSIE
Date: Tue Jan 8 13:10:42 2002

Message:
LISTEN CUNT, YOU ARE NOT WORTHY TO SMELL OUT SHIT.  IN FACT, OUR 
SHIT SMELLS LIKE ROSES.  YOU ARE ANOTHER LITTLE JEALOUS 
COCKSUCKER THAT WANTS TO HANG ON OUR BALLS.  FUCK YOU, YOU 
KANGAROO FUCKEN PEICE OF SHIT.  DONT EVER SAY SHIT ABOUT OUR 
WQNDERFUL COUNTRY. WHAT ARE YOU DOING ON THIS BOARD ANYWAY, YOU 
FUCKEN INCOMPLETE ABORTION?  DONT FUCK WITH ME.  I JUST HAD SIX 
CUPS OF COFFEE AND EIGGHT CANDY BARS AND I AM ON A SUGAR HIGH 
AND OUT TO KICK YOUR ASS DOWN UNDER.  WHAT THE FUCK IS YOUR 
PROBLEM?  I HOPE YOU GET A NICE ROCKET UP YOUR ASS FOR YOUR 
BIRTHDAY?  FUCK YOU. FUCK YOU. FUCK YOU. FUCK YOU.  

HI JOHN! ABOUT TIME YOU GET BACK ON THIS BOARD AND HONOR US WITH 
YOUR PRESENCE.  GLAD TO SEE YOU BACK.  WHAT THE HELL HAPPENED TO 
EAGLE EYE?  I LIKE THE WAY HE JUST DISAPPEARS FROM THIS BOARD, 
DAMMIT TO HELL.  HE SHOULD GET HIS ASS BACK ON HERE.  WE ARE 
CONSTANTLY HAVING TO CLEAN UP THIS FUCKEN BOARD WITH ALL THE 
LOWLIFES THAT FLY ON HERE, LIKE THIS AUSSIE BITCH.  

AUSSIE BITCH;  I AM NOT FINSIHED WITH YOU CUNT.  G'DAY MATE, YOU 
MOTHER FUCKER, WITH YORU FUCKENT LEATHER SKIN FROM BEING OUT IN 
THE SUN ALL DAY, YOU MORON, YOUR BRAINS (?) ARE OBVIOUSLY AS 
FRIED AS YOUR DICK/CUNT BOTH ARE, YOU FUCKERN HERMAPHRIDITE.  I 
WILL CLEAN UP THE STREETS WITH YOU, BITCH.  YOU LITTLE FUCKEN 
IMBECILE, COCKSUCKER, FUCKEN DOUCHEBAG, MOTHER FUCKER, STARTING 
SHIT EARLY IN THE DAY......... FUCK YOU, FUCK YOU, FUCK YOU. 

From: Get a grip
To: All
Subject: Time
Date: Tue Jan 8 13:28:17 2002

Message:
Where do you all get the time to write all this, and to spend it 
on shuch that say what they do! Oy! Have a sense of humor 
already! I gotta skip it, just don't have the time. It all means 
a lot don't get me wrong, but sheeeeeeeeeesh! Hey Aussi! Is the 
fire out yet?? Merlyn predicted it and figured it set by 
terrorists, any info on that? Do you know you've been hit?? And 
English Dudes, any thoughts on the Hoof & mouth, terrorist 
connection. Seems Anthrax & hoof & mouth are about the same 
level of style, for a sand box army. 

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Get a Grip, Everyman, Allatti2d, John, Open Mind/Closed Fist
Date: Tue Jan 8 15:46:08 2002

Message:
Get a Grip: Liked your post about the cows, one shouldn't laugh 
but much of it's true. Spy, if I remember rightly, wrote 
something similar a while back to what you did. I'm sure someone 
could..er...come up with what happens when two cows that arrive 
at a British Corporation, but what with Mad Cow disease and Foot 
& Mouth (don't ask!)...the cows would already be dead before 
getting to the punchline. I think the Hoof & Mouth (as you call 
it) epidemic started, through the import of infected meat, it 
cross contaminated somehow. Was that a deliberate act, in light 
of current events?..probably not...in my opinion.

Keep the humour going, at every opportunity! Good to hear from 
you sir.

Everyman: Of course those same protesters you spoke of would 
probably would be the first to give a sigh of relief when they 
see the police, when someone's trying to steal their property. 
It's all so different then. Downtown Portland huh...tempted to 
ask what you saw there...but I won't.:-)

Allatti2d: Miss, we're all wondering what happens in that booth?

John: Ross Perot, just curious, what did you think of him as a 
candidate prior to his outburst that related to his family? I 
didn't pay much attention to the campaign in general for fairly 
obvious reasons, but I remember him speaking on couple of 
occasions and he at least 'seemed' O.K.

Om/cf: Regarding your President, goodness knows people have 
tried to fault him, but they can't. Some will critisize no 
matter what. He's done little wrong in my view. He's been very 
reponsible in focusing on terrorism, rather than a religion or 
an ethnic group. It's a fine line to tread but he and his 
advisers in my view have done pretty well so far. So many people 
doubted him in his ability to cope under this kind of pressure, 
prior to his election. They'd already pre-judged him. I watched 
him at his inauguration and he seemed as nervous as hell, but 
compare that to his speech to congress, with our Prime Minister 
in attendance and his transformation in character was obvious. 
Knowing his rocky past he must have had doubts, but he rose to 
the challange. I recall watching one time, as he approached the 
Presidential helicopter, sneaking up on the obligatory solitary 
soldier in parade uniform that has to stand beside it, catching  
him completely unawares and saluting him up close, the soldier 
broke out in a grin and saluted back in haste. That to me gave a 
small insight into what kind of person he is.

You're right though, a week in politics is long time, let alone 
a whole term. So much can go wrong. As for you're flag, well 
maybe it's simply the thought that counts! Thank goodness for 
suction cups, huh?        

From: Get a grip
To: Parents
Subject: Child abuse!
Date: Tue Jan 8 17:43:32 2002

Message:
Holy bath tub Bat Man! Just go figure letting a Psyco give a few 
kids a bath, Yates? You are SICK! I hope they send you to 
Afghanistan so you can be given a taste of real problems! Man 
what a piece of work! and they let you have 5 children!?????
What were they thinking! In & out of the nut house and popping 
out kids, Hey DADDY! where were you??? Screwing around town???? 
Why add to the nut farm when it was such a serious problem???  
  In the name of Christ!! Get a grip!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Get a Grip
Subject: Hoof (Foot) & Mouth
Date: Tue Jan 8 19:31:30 2002

Message:
Deliberate act?, tell Merlyn I said, I wouldn't rule it out.... 
completely:-)

From: om/cf
To: All & Amazed
Subject: Reid II
Date: Tue Jan 8 17:45:10 2002

Message:
Amazed (on the attack and people in the WTC):

The only innocents in there were the foreigners: those who 
had no part in supporting the US government's evil foreign 
policy which incited those attacks.
________________________________________________________________

 Talk about evil arrogance! This sounds like a quote from
bin Laden himself. The people in those buildings were there to
work to support their families who no longer have them. If you 
think any of the people killed were there for the sole purpose
of supporting any kind of foreign policy you are wrong. Not only
are you wrong, you are one fucked up human being.
 On a personel level, when you incite me to violence, it should
be OK for me to kill your family members because they support
you, by your reasoning.



From: om/cf
To: Walter
Subject: Clinton
Date: Tue Jan 8 21:25:19 2002

Message:
Clinton was so busy cleaning up after his own weaknesses he 
didnt have time for much else. During his second term I couldnt
even watch his speeches. What a fucking leader! I really didnt 
give a fuck if Bush or Gore won at one point, just happy Clinton 
was gone. I mean for christs sake, the top dog was a comical 
fucking joke. And to hear people defending him just blew me (no 
pun intended) away.
 I read Clinton is sorry now, he might have missed a few 
opportunities to get bin Laden. Im sure he is "feeling our pain".
Like I said in a previous post, I was saddened to read about his
dog getting hit by a car. If it had been Bill Clinton hit by the
car, I may have cracked a smile.
 I dont think much of his money grubbing bitch of a (cough, 
cough) wife either. I cant believe how after the attacks she was 
on every fucking thing I watched on television. She jumped all 
over that bandwagon. I know that bitch is positioning herself 
(something she didnt do much of for Bill) for a run at President 
and now that Chelsea is all grown up, I hope she gets whacked.

From: Walter
To: om/cf
Date: Tue Jan 8 22:17:46 2002

Message:
I guess I'm just a cynical bastard,but most of the times I've 
just voted for the guy I hated the least,and hoped for the 
best.The last two elections I've felt like I was asked,"Do you 
want your shit sandwich on wheat or white?"But I do think that 
George has handled our current situation better than Al would 
have.

From: Fact Finders
To: whoever
Subject: Wake up
Date: Tue Jan 8 22:26:40 2002

Message:
American got fuck again, told you people not to trust those 
bastard in Afghan. They are all the same. They are all actors. 
They catch the taliban in one hand and release them with the 
other. Same as Mr Arafat. They say the Omar and Osama will not 
have such privilege. Who need these privilege, they were 
probably release long before they were even captured. Those 
ungrateful leaders. The allies should just leave them alone, let 
the rich muslims nations help them. So if in future they support 
the stupid Islamic cause. We can kick their ass again without 
feeling any regrets.

Put Mr Pastoon on your wanted list too. This guy does not fit 
help run Afghan. He has a release men who brought so much 
suffering to his country.

These pussy who call for jihad are to be shot dead to pay for 
those, they brainwash and sent to do their killing. Always claim 
to fight to their last breath. They are all coward

Wake up all you good people, especially muslims, realize that 
the world would be a better place if all these bastard are 
capture and put away and never to spoilt the good name of Islam 
again.

From: om/cf
To: Walter
Date: Tue Jan 8 22:51:56 2002

Message:
I know what ya mean. The days of Republicans are for the rich, 
and Democrats are for the working man are long gone. They both 
check all the opinion polls as to what gives them the best 
chance to win and end up at the same place.
 I always vote, but it sure is easy to see why a lot of people 
in the U.S. dont. But the Presidential election sure the hell was
interesting on election night this go around! I also loved how 
the networks got burned with their projected results! The whole 
ordeal kind of renewed my interest as I hope it did for many.

From: DON'T TREAD ON ME
To: you guys
Subject: Catchin' Up - Who Are These Muttonheads ?
Date: Tue Jan 8 23:52:21 2002

Message:
Catching up here.  Did anyone say anything to Amazed, who called 
Geo Washington and Ben FRanklin terrorists ? Was that stupid, or 
what ? Is there supposed to be some moral equivalence between 
George Washington and UBL ?  Puh-leeeeze.  Amazed has gotten 
better. He's gone two or three posts without using the 
word "odious". Keep up the good work, mate

And just who is that autralian knucklehead ? I knew the Aussies 
wpould send troops and be on our side.  He's right about one 
thing. 9/11 was a wakeup call for us. But think about it, 
dummy.  If America was doing so many "bad things" before getting 
this wake-up call, you aint seen nuthin' yet.  And 90% of the 
people support it.  So tough shit.  You're either with us or 
against us.  Sad to tell ya, but Austarlia is with us. 4000 
Afghan civilians dead ?  Says you.  Whered'd you get those 
figures ?  Even if they are right, so what ? We got a wake up 
call, remember ? And we're very onery.  At least you didn't 
describe them as "innocent" civilians.  Who's to say how many 
were legitimate military targets ?  Who's to say how many were 
put in harm's way by pussy Taliban or al-Queda in the silly hope 
that we wouldn't bomb them ?

From: John
To: Walter, UK Citizen, Justice USA, et al
Subject: ... I just accept it. It's their problem. Not mine.
Date: Wed Jan 9 11:04:32 2002

Message:
I said - You said:  I think maybe we got lucky with the slut as 
president.  Ross would have heard the Soviet's (little voices) 
planning against us with all those ears.
______________________________________________________

Yeah....real lucky!Multi-billion Enron robbery,and 2 two world 
trade center towers knocked down,Anthrax scare,billions spent on 
bombs to kill a few thousand,etc.With no end in sight.Too bad 
Cliton couldn't do his fuckin job getting bin Laden like was 
promised in 92,93,95,and 97,maybe we'd have a World Trade Center 
today....and 3,000 more citizens.Lucky.....

********

Agreed, 1000% !  cept, it's kinda like lost mail.  Ya never know 
what ya don't get.  What nightmares could Ross have brought for 
us all?  Thank Allah we'll never know.

*******

UK Citizen, you asked:  "John: Ross Perot, just curious, what 
did you think of him as a candidate prior to his outburst that 
related to his family? I didn't pay much attention to the 
campaign in general for fairly obvious reasons, but I remember 
him speaking on couple of occasions and he at least 'seemed' 
O.K."

*****

For about three weeks I was a Perot supporter.  I actually 
believed at one point he could (maybe) win.  And he might have 
had he not (thankfully) shown us he's absolutely nuts.  I only 
wish when he dropped out, he stayed out.  If so, the slut would 
have never been the presidential slut.

*******

Justice USA,  Hi, I'm down to a 31" waist.  If you're gonna 
bring in food, Please, no candy bars.  I no longer wish to 
attempt to set these morons like Aussie & Amazed (who is UK 
Voices) straight.  They're idiots.  They've made up their minds 
based on absolutely NO data.  I just accept it.  It's their 
problem.  Not mine.

Have a great day!

John
E pluribus unum

From: Johnny b ticked
To: all who give a shit
Subject: gotcha
Date: Wed Jan 9 12:16:51 2002

Message:
osama bin fuckin laden did not terrorize new york city, i did 
hahahahahahahahahahaha boy did we trick you. so please now that 
you know stop talking about him b/c it is pissing me off, i have 
had enough of him already

From: U.K.Citizen
To: Amazed
Subject: Continued Ref: Post Jan 5 21:12:36
Date: Wed Jan 9 09:48:30 2002

Message:
Continuing on...

Quote:

"Over there in the good ol' USA, the American people just *love* 
showing support for terrorists and giving them money."

Unuote.

O.K...let's clear up a few misconceptions here..shall we?. While 
it's certainly true that since the 70's a number of the Irish 
American community in cities such as Boston and New york, have 
contributed to the I.R.A's fighting fund, many were lured into 
giving money because those raising the money, cleverly set 
themselves up as Irish charities with a benign image. Those 
giving...in the main, were none the wiser. The actual proportion 
of those in the Irish-American community who give money over, 
has always and still is, hugely exaggerated. There has been AND 
still is, a hard-core of I.R.A. sympathisers and fundraisers 
both of which know full-well the repercussions of their 
activities..Mass Murder. Over the years, unbeknown to the 
I.A.community, the I.R.A. had increasingly moved into the 
political arena since the height of the troubles in the early 
70's. Many of the I.A.community have, over the years, been left 
behind in their knowledge of the changing political 
circumstances in Northern Ireland. If you think the I.R.A. get 
their funds from the U.S. alone...then WAKE UP EINSTEIN!...try 
directing your accusations to some of those nice South and 
Central American drug lords. Go ahead!!..when you're next in 
Texas on business, take a little flight down to THAT part of the 
world and start waving you're accusing finger at them. Not that 
you'd actually ACT on your principles there, for fear of having 
your body vented by Uzi's and AK 47's. Ask certain elements 
within the Estonian government, why THEY'VE been dealing with 
Real I.R.A. activists.

If you're SO in favour of wishing peace to your fellow man, why, 
by YOUR accusations then incite hatred of America's Irish 
community, which it is tantamount to doing?. Trying to start 
another U.S. Civil War perhaps?...Oh..but of course!...ALL 
Americans are terrorist sympathisers right?...I'm sure you'd 
spotted many a I.R.A. sympathiser whilst in say, Dallas or Fort 
Worth, those WELL KNOWN hotbeds of Irish Republicanism!

You DON'T like Gerry Adams..oh really!!...funny how you HAD to 
state that for the record, isn't it?. Mr.Adams' early past 
sir...is shadowy...at best! Along with the esteemed Martin 
McGuinness (now N.I. Minister for Schools!)...and YOU'RE... 
swallowing your distaste?....try swallowing your TOUNGE! I 
suppose you'd be happy having an ex-terrorist in charge of 
overseeing your child's education, yet more cheap talk...I 
SOMEHOW DOUBT IT. But hey..so long as you feel nice n' safe 
huh?...

...and following the valiant freedom fighter's herioc strike 
against the cleaners and office worker 'terrorists' in New York 
and Washington, as your unfathomable mind seen it, please tell 
us all it was MERE COINCIDENCE that the likes of Gerry Adams and 
Yasser Arafat were peeing down their legs, in front of the 
world's press saying how SORRY and appalled they were....they 
KNEW the game was up, and if they hadn't spoken out, they would 
have kissed their chances of political power goodbye, 
there...and then!! Arafat..still blew his chance.

The ONLY reason there has been ANY progress in Northern Ireland 
is because the Clinton adminstration gave weight to what SDLP 
leader John Hume told them, NOT Gerry..fucking Adams!..wake..UP!

McGuinness planted the bombs, Adams condoned it...they simply 
lost the plot Amazed, as have al-Qaeda and bin Laden, WHATEVER 
their cause, however JUST they think it is, gives nobody 
the 'RIGHT' to do what they did. Period.


You're posts....Amazed, are a veritable GOLD-MINE of utter 
drivel,...by the way,...I briefly scanned your reply to me, that 
basically involved typing out most of my original post...gee 
thanks!...pughole! Oh, and replies such as:-

Quote:

"Why Not?"

Unquote.

....whilst in your mind are quite profound, just aren't good 
enough Amazed....you'll have to do better than that.

As you maybe be aware, this post has simply refered to one of 
your paragraphed 'pearls of wisdom'....you can safely assume 
there's more to follow.

(And lastly...as the Euro was actually the subject of the 
discussion, I'm fully with my rights, gramatically speaking..to 
put use a capital E. Now if one's talking about, a euro...that's 
different..seeeeee!, but I'M talking about...'The'...Euro...just 
like 'the' Pound, 'the' Dollar, 'the' Lira.....ohhh Nevermind.) 

   

From: Get a grip
To: all
Subject: Euro
Date: Wed Jan 9 12:55:34 2002

Message:
Anyone for a big game of Monopoly?!! Just who does the world 
bank think they are playing with?? Don't think standardization 
of the world currency might just flop when the WORD STOCK MARKET 
CRASHES????. Talk about dropping the gold standard! That Euro 
crap will be usless play money in a very short time. Just a peek 
into the future. 
 Writing checks with my ass...
       Get a grip. 

From: John
To: Johnny b ticked
Subject: ... I feel very sorry for you.
Date: Wed Jan 9 12:50:10 2002

Message:
You said --> osama bin fuckin laden did not terrorize new york 
city, i did hahahahahahahahahahaha boy did we trick you. so 
please now that you know stop talking about him b/c it is 
pissing me off, i have had enough of him already

*********

To even think such is outright sick.  Those around you (I'm 
certain) know how sick you are.  You looney bird are headed 
straight for the looney bin.  Frontal-lobotomies and shock 
treatments are no longer the norm within such institutions.  But 
be assured mind altering drugs are.  I feel very sorry for you.

John
E...

From: Get a grip
To: Just can't take it
Subject: Oooooooooo man!
Date: Wed Jan 9 12:55:34 2002

Message:
Aliens from space just landed! And one looks like Osama! New CIA 
intelligance documents found in Afghanistan show it was all a 
plot by Clintons Dog! He was Knocked off by the KGB! And James 
Bond is flying in on a twin prop! Oh this just in James wont be 
with us! he was shot down by a 14 year old kid who said he was a 
CIA agent! Ho He Hoy! OOOOOOOOoooooooomy I just can't take it!  

From: Merlyn
To: Mike Chinoy
Subject: Bibles
Date: Wed Jan 9 14:28:48 2002

Message:
Mike Chinoy! Your a brave man. May Gods eye follow your path! 
     Merlyn /|\

From: Get a grip
To: UN
Subject: Euro/ euro
Date: Wed Jan 9 17:48:36 2002

Message:
Mmmmmmmmm first comes the Euro.....then World tax... I'll take 
park place & conneticut Av. OOps Don't pass Go. Go directly to 
jail! Oh fiddle, where is my get out of jail free card!!! Guess 
a railroad or two will do. 

From: Walter
To: Get a grip
Date: Wed Jan 9 22:00:34 2002

Message:
You're more safe in jail than on Baltic Ave.with its four crack 
houses................comon,roll the dice!

From: Get a grip
To: Walter
Subject: My Roll
Date: Wed Jan 9 23:09:48 2002

Message:
Damn, snake eyes, Back on park place. I'll buy a hotel and two 
houses. Oh wait? what is that in Euros?
http://www.euro.fee.be/

From:
To:
Subject:
Message:
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